Prelude: World 16.1

[Zephroze]

I don't know what it is with this game's community acting like repercussions for PKing is some new foreign concept. Plenty of games bestow negative traits to players who PK. In UO your characters name turns red and you can't go into towns and other players can attack and kill you without losing any karma or having it count towards their name going red too. Killing should come with downsides; you want to play the role as the murderer then you accept the repercussions.
I still PK'd all the time in UO, my characters were permanently red for the 4 years I played one private server. I didn't bitch and cry that there shouldn't be downsides, it was expected. You want to be a player killer? Here's the downsides you'll have to endure.

I too have suggested removing the murderer's ability to hearth and fast travel but I think making both of those permanent is way too overkill. Have it be a red-handed sort of effect only it lasts 3-5 days. That should be annoying as fuck enough to make people think twice about what they're doing. Makes the people that do it remain on edge whenever they're out because they can be tracked and will have to make it back to safety purely on foot. Shouldn't be an issue, people here are always talking about how easy it is to run from encounters, so what's the big deal?

This 1 change would have the bonus of rangers becoming a viable playstyle again because you can hunt people whos scent you have, knowing when they're not at their hearth, comfortable in the fact that they're not gonna have you running across the world only to have the target hearth away from you.

>B-b-but what about the naked scout alts
Wow, look at that, a problem arises with alts! Who the fuck would have thought? Oh wait, me I did.
I said a few pages ago (and years ago as well), alts have always been an issue, and they always will be. Having multiple accounts should not be allowed and should be punishable by banning. Ban the main and the alt accounts of those people. Main account should have 3 character slots at most. You wanna waste one of those slots on an alt? Fine, still stops you from having your main character + alt on at the same time.

All problems with this game and why would be solutions can't be implemented fall back to "but alts!" so deal with the alts. Crazy concept, I know.

Even if the alt problem doesn't get fixed the other solution should still be added. I'm sick of hearing about naked alts doing this and that and why we can't make good changes because of them.

There's no such thing as a permanent ban.

I'll elaborate from last time I said it, you can spoof your IP and even your machine ID, so there's absolutely no way that you can permanently ban somebody from anything, ever.

The only thing this will do is keep alts accessible only to autistic retards (you know who)

[Crest]

There's no such thing as a permanent ban.

I'll elaborate from last time I said it, you can spoof your IP and even your machine ID, so there's absolutely no way that you can permanently ban somebody from anything, ever.

The only thing this will do is keep alts accessible only to autistic retards (you know who)

I use VPN's all the time and my IP is dynamic anyway; I turn it off then on and I have a new IP. I'm aware you can theoretically get around this but if it's annoying enough to do and it runs the risk of the offenders main account getting banned (and just about everybody that I have in mind has a shit load of hats on their main accounts which they won't want to risk) it will deter people from doing it. Ban the account they have subbed and verified, they'll at minimum need to repay for those again because nobody is seriously playing without them.

Right now, it is commonplace to have multiple accounts to do all sorts of shit because it's allowed and there's nothing stopping you. Naked alts have always been the bane of this game, rather than just doing nothing and saying it'll never work they should at lea-
...You know what, mid typing this I've just remembered who is running the game. This is fucking pointless. There's no shot they're going to keep up with who is playing what account, we barely even heard from them this year when we did the updates were nothingburgers. Took them like 10 years just to try worlds with shorter life cycles, Credo's are still shit when one minor change (which would take them like 30 minutes to code in) could make them fine, yeah, this is retarded, I dunno why I keep deluding myself thinking some of these changes will ever have a shot at going through, especially the ones that are more hands on and require the devs to keep on top of things.

My bad I guess.

[kabuto202]

I guarantee you that my capacity (as a theoretical service provider) to set up automated detection for your accounts and random ban waves that trigger every few months to ensure the hundreds of your hours are wasted every time you get rebanned is going to outpace your capacity to keep on building up new accounts and figuring out exactly which action triggered the detection.

But this is largely an irrelevant discussion. Jorbtar will never have any real enforcement for this. It's a matter of desire, not technological capacity. There's no HnH exceptionalism where rules are uniquely unenforceable here as opposed to anywhere else and no amount of gaslighting by scriptkiddies is going to change that.

Personally, if I ever have time between more important projects. I want to build-up a custom client that utilizes a local server to create a botnet that effectively converts this game into Dwarf Fortress. Automate account creation to spawn a new dwarf, create a middleware layer where each client acts as an entity representing the dwarf, and let the server act as a centralized control (reading input data from each client and sending back individual commands). In theory it'd be the same as programming any actual server-based game AI, in-fact, I could probably utilize some websockets based game server solution as the frame for this. Then just present this all on some webapp so you can give the dwarves some manual commands and/or assign them to specific roles. Assign specific zones and label various containers or what not. If this is going to be a game catered for bots rather than actual players, might as well make the best of it.

[TemuSoldier]

this is retarded, I dunno why I keep deluding myself

no notes!

[Crest]

But this is largely an irrelevant discussion. Jorbtar will never have any real enforcement for this. It's a matter of desire, not technological capacity. There's no HnH exceptionalism where rules are uniquely unenforceable here as opposed to anywhere else and no amount of gaslighting by scriptkiddies is going to change that.

Exactly.
The games had so many other issues which IMO are so unbelievably easy to fix, yet they never have been (or they eventually do years later), that it makes me wonder wtf I was thinking in regard to them implementing and enforcing a no alt account thing.
Such a shame.

[Rebs]

*Goes to the shop to buy more popcorn*

[_Scipio]

[Zephroze]

I guarantee you that my capacity (as a theoretical service provider) to set up automated detection for your accounts and random ban waves that trigger every few months to ensure the hundreds of your hours are wasted every time you get rebanned is going to outpace your capacity to keep on building up new accounts and figuring out exactly which action triggered the detection.

But this is largely an irrelevant discussion. Jorbtar will never have any real enforcement for this. It's a matter of desire, not technological capacity. There's no HnH exceptionalism where rules are uniquely unenforceable here as opposed to anywhere else and no amount of gaslighting by scriptkiddies is going to change that.

Personally, if I ever have time between more important projects. I want to build-up a custom client that utilizes a local server to create a botnet that effectively converts this game into Dwarf Fortress. Automate account creation to spawn a new dwarf, create a middleware layer where each client acts as an entity representing the dwarf, and let the server act as a centralized control (reading input data from each client and sending back individual commands). In theory it'd be the same as programming any actual server-based game AI, in-fact, I could probably utilize some websockets based game server solution as the frame for this. Then just present this all on some webapp so you can give the dwarves some manual commands and/or assign them to specific roles. Assign specific zones and label various containers or what not. If this is going to be a game catered for bots rather than actual players, might as well make the best of it.

But how will you stop your legendary smiths from slipping into the lava forge because they got too drunk

[Zephroze]

Using OSRS as comparison like many others are here's the facts.

Even with lots of systems and people in place to prevent botting and alts, it's not possible to get all of them. (OSRS has this constant issue)

This shit (barely) runs on Java and would probably need a whole engine update just to make these systems even possible, plus a team of moderators to manually check each case to avoid false flag bans. (RS3 has a much lesser bot problem)

2 fresh alt bots are more efficient than 1 verified and subbed alt bot. It doesn't matter how many are banned. (People on OSRS will often just kill bots for funding rather than anything else because they make more money, not gold, USD, online or at a real job, than any single player regardless of level) (Venezuela's entire economy is backed by OSRS gold)

Hats can be transferred or RMT'd to negate any losses. (Plenty of mule bots on OSRS get away with this)

I would also love to play on this game where alt clients and alt accounts aren't necessary but this isn't the game we're playing. (Runelite)

Also you gotta remember the most important thing, that the devs are making the game they want to make, and feedback is only useful to them if it helps with that. They will never implement something that goes against their vision, and that includes hiring a bunch of moderators they will spend more time monitoring (OSRS Mod Jed situation) than actually enjoying their game.

[Zephroze]

But this is largely an irrelevant discussion. Jorbtar will never have any real enforcement for this. It's a matter of desire, not technological capacity. There's no HnH exceptionalism where rules are uniquely unenforceable here as opposed to anywhere else and no amount of gaslighting by scriptkiddies is going to change that.

Exactly.
The games had so many other issues which IMO are so unbelievably easy to fix, yet they never have been (or they eventually do years later), that it makes me wonder wtf I was thinking in regard to them implementing and enforcing a no alt account thing.
Such a shame.

It's also just that the way the characters have to be built discourages you from having only a single character. Forcing people to play together to cover every niche is horrible for player retention. Some people just want to solo.