Game Development: Beavertopia

[2d0x]

nvm I assumed you were implying it's childish babble to imply that Dis said "i suck at combat therefore im not going"

I said it was just a stupid excuse.

[Sollar]

I welcome the KO>hearthfire with a full loot option, and some wounds to make sure the KO'd character can't just jump on back into the middle of the action. Implement this, reset the world and watch the playerbase

[NOOBY93]

I welcome the KO>hearthfire with a full loot option, and some wounds to make sure the KO'd character can't just jump on back into the middle of the action. Implement this, reset the world and watch the playerbase

Wounds are a given - even without getting KO'd, if you get cleaved for a lot of damage, the wretched gores can take half a year or more to heal (if you don't have ancient roots)

[Josemite]

i think if you guys were to do this you should only make it a thing for chars under a certain stat limit say like under 100-200ua and some combat attributes or something. also a lot of the people dying in combat now dont even get koed they jsut die immediately and this would remain the case for almost all nab kills unfortunately!!!

ALSO i think that they should be ported back to their hearth fire completely NAKED and all curios/equipment/inventory should be dropped on the ground where they were koed and remain there for a certain period of time

GR8 UPD8

I'm actually kind of surprised you're on board with changing away from hard permadeath. But yes, most certainly if any form of "not permadeath" happens, full loot seems perfectly appropriate for haven. +1

~

I support this development, but as I've raised in C&I recently, I also feel like we could replace permadeath with a tweaked wounding system + full loot to have a similar adrenaline/rush. But without risking an ever mounting amount of effort put into a character, and rather a fixed recovery effort/time via the wound.

I'm glad other people are willing to raise this point, since it's typically something I find as an opinion in players who play the game but aren't visible on the forums.

I like this idea. As a n00b hermit I think swapping out permadeath with something working with the current wound system would be a good change. I think alot of players are lost to losing a char (would be an interesting stat for sure). Some thoughts:

• Keep looting of some degree to make PvP still rewarding but make it something that doesn't permanently set back players.
• Have some ability to delay respawning so you can't get HF camped.
• Have the wounds be something more affecting your HP. Reducing stats too much would basically make it so you couldn't do anything until getting rid of the wounds without messing up the QL of everything.
• Maybe have there be varying degrees to which you can deal with the wounds. Some treatments that are easy, some that are expensive, others that just take time. Could be a nice balancing thing but would be hard to do without giving someone dozens of different wounds...

Overall I think this would be great. Would make death annoying without being devastating, particularly for more casual players. We keep nerfing death and adding funerals and such to make it less painful, should just switch to a new system that works well with the existing wounds imo. This would also be a nice way to make it so people that die repeatedly in PvP would be more penalized than the person who just randomly got ganked. Would make it so people are just throwing alts at trolls because losing a main is too costly. And would probably encourage more PvP activity. If the penalties are lessened, there will be less hesitation to grab a gang and go bopping other villages, and those on the receiving end would be less likely to just log off and take a nap instead of playing.

[NOOBY93]

Keep looting of some degree to make PvP still rewarding but make it something that doesn't permanently set back players.

Such as full gear, inventory and study loot. +

Have some ability to delay respawning so you can't get HF camped.

Just build a palisade. If you actually get HF camped you messed up anyway - or someone REALLY wanted you dead. Also, if your village gets broken into, I think the siegers should have the capability of actually killing you that way.

Have the wounds be something more affecting your HP.

That's... That's what they already are. Just wait until you have 250 wretched gores. The -stats on stitched up will be the least of your worries.

Maybe have there be varying degrees to which you can deal with the wounds. Some treatments that are easy, some that are expensive, others that just take time.

Already in the game. Multiple treatments for some wounds, along with the "ancient root", that is expensive (rare) but faster than anything.

[stenz]

returned to hearth fire when knockout, best thing I could ever dream of.

[Josemite]

Have some ability to delay respawning so you can't get HF camped.

Just build a palisade. If you actually get HF camped you messed up anyway - or someone REALLY wanted you dead. Also, if your village gets broken into, I think the siegers should have the capability of actually killing you that way.

Moreso I'm worried about if there was in fact no permadeath then you could just camp them and tank their stats for the rest of eternity. And if your HF is safe there's no reason to not return to it... dunno maybe some sort of diminishing returns instead?

Have the wounds be something more affecting your HP.

That's... That's what they already are. Just wait until you have 250 wretched gores. The -stats on stitched up will be the least of your worries.

This was moreso I'd caution against a -90% to all stats type of penalty (like they have for concussion)... I wouldn't want to plant crops etc until my stats more or less recovered because it would undo weeks of bring seed QL up.

Maybe have there be varying degrees to which you can deal with the wounds. Some treatments that are easy, some that are expensive, others that just take time.

Already in the game. Multiple treatments for some wounds, along with the "ancient root", that is expensive (rare) but faster than anything.

I was thinking more along the lines of "You can easily deal with this component of the "death" penalty, it's a pain to deal with this but can be done, while this part you have no recourse on, the sort of guaranteed penalty of death?

[Sevenless]

I welcome the KO>hearthfire with a full loot option, and some wounds to make sure the KO'd character can't just jump on back into the middle of the action. Implement this, reset the world and watch the playerbase

Even if we remove permadeath completely (just the wounding system, which as Nooby points out is still a serious blow in pvp due to wretched gore), I don't think this fixes haven's endgame snooze. I think what it does is open up the possibility of things like: Equipment replacement required via kos (gear needs to get destroyed sometimes, so the gear existing in the world sees turnover) and more frequent pvp encouragement via game mechanics.

We would still need these additional mechanics to make endgame more engaging, and possibly catchup mechanics for late starters/base wiped players, if we wanted to have longer term worlds where players felt they could start playing and not be "forever uncompetitive".

It should always be possible to start from scratch and get to a point where you can at least contest Q leaders in fights, even if they'll always have that edge.

[ven]

I don't see how this is any less permadeath than the reimplementation of inheritance, einherjer, and state funerals. It's not like noobs won't be killed or that there will be no consequence in being reckless with your characters.
If we've already reached this point, I think it's worth testing it out until the end of the world.

[NOOBY93]

I welcome the KO>hearthfire with a full loot option, and some wounds to make sure the KO'd character can't just jump on back into the middle of the action. Implement this, reset the world and watch the playerbase

Even if we remove permadeath completely (just the wounding system, which as Nooby points out is still a serious blow in pvp due to wretched gore), I don't think this fixes haven's endgame snooze. I think what it does is open up the possibility of things like: Equipment replacement required via kos (gear needs to get destroyed sometimes, so the gear existing in the world sees turnover) and more frequent pvp encouragement via game mechanics.

We would still need these additional mechanics to make endgame more engaging, and possibly catchup mechanics for late starters/base wiped players, if we wanted to have longer term worlds where players felt they could start playing and not be "forever uncompetitive".

It should always be possible to start from scratch and get to a point where you can at least contest Q leaders in fights, even if they'll always have that edge.

For this I proposed a system: Questing that rewards you a huge amount if you don't use curios, less if you do - and all curios reward you less if you do quests.

Really high quality grinders would always have an edge because of curios, but people who join in the middle of the world could spam quests as a way to get LP without having to quality grind, although it would be slower, less safe and you would have to play actively (can't just relog for 2 minutes like curio grinders could)

This, combined with a way in combat to beat someone with higher stats than yourself (which is nonexistent atm, having higher agility and strength, and better gear means you win 100% of the time if you play it right), could actually make joining in the middle of the world and being a guerrilla fighter a legit tactic.