Game Development: Harvest Skis

Announcements about major changes in Haven & Hearth.

Re: Game Development: Harvest Skis

Postby Massa » Fri Oct 22, 2021 4:55 am

AriZona wrote:
SnuggleSnail wrote:Rly loving the patches lately

  • Remove crop circles
  • Remove realm buffs
  • Remove crop growth speed fields (if they remain relevant to quality growth)

    .......
  • Crop Q growth made based on how long they've been growing(If the flax gob has existed 16H +5, if 32 hours +10 capped at ~ 3-7 days)
  • Trellis cropQ increases rolled on harvest so the plants don't need to be destroyed

I assume most if not all of these are self evident. Will provide reasoning/details upon request if I don't think the person asking is a retard


In other words (if I understand correctly): remove chores to have more time for killing x1000 times weaker hermits :D

All of these are great ideas.

The crop circles part is probably a joke because they're aesthetically hideous (I don't really mind them) but heinously inefficient. They're the pinnacle of a backwards attempt at efficiency.
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Re: Game Development: Harvest Skis

Postby SnuggleSnail » Fri Oct 22, 2021 5:14 am

Na, I unironically think crop circles are the single most egregiously bad piece of content in the game. They're not so much horrible in the sense they don't really affect me because I just ignore them and accept I'll always have bad qualities, but in that they add absolutely nothing and are obviously irredeemably bad.

>80% of quality comes from bones/rocks/ore/cave clay/hide straps. Stuff that never really increases, so you get to like 80% of the maximum quality that's achievable within the first month or two of a world. We made a >Q400 anvil in like 4-6 or so weeks. Maybe less, I don't rly remember. (((I wish WWWs all started at Q10, and animal products/rocks were wayyyyy lower at the beginning of the world to alleviate this a bit. That's another topic tho)))

Without flax/turnips increasing qualities passively over time quality grinding bois completely run out of things to do, and there's no reason to really ever remake/upgrade industry. The crop circles get progressively harder to maintain, to the point that it's unrealistic for non-botters to do it(and it's trivial to bot, other than the initial setup). Completely stagnates the world's quality growth. Likewise weirdos who genuinely seem to enjoy farming for quality are usually somewhat casual, and aren't going to want to put the like 10+ hours a week that crop circles are going to necessitate spending to continue doing the thing they enjoy.

In longer worlds whichever groups abuse crop circles(there literally aren't even enough heartwood trees in the world for more than a few groups to use them in a ~2 year world before you even consider people intentionally monopolizing it) will by default have wayyyyyyy higher qualities than everybody else just from flax/turnips being dank.

It's kindof(?) okay because people can rely on the WWW catchup mechanic, but realistically it seems like that needs to be botted to have a good chance of getting topQ stuff. Especially considering average players aren't running around with 500, 1000, 2000 farming to passively get them very occasionally. It can only be intentionally farmed.
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IMO, long term chores where you can fall behind and not really catch up are awful, and this is the worst example of that. It's such a time gated grind, but the intervals between needing to do things are short enough that you'd need to mess up your sleep schedule just to be somewhat efficient. Then, on top of that you need to abuse potentially hundreds of alts and compete with other players just to get localized resources, and you have to maintain these activities for potentially years. Then if you weren't botting your qualities will still be shit compared to the people who do, and if you stop for even a little while your progress is kinda ruined. It's literally the worst of every world.
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Re: Game Development: Harvest Skis

Postby Agrik » Fri Oct 22, 2021 7:54 am

Sevenless wrote:Hauling barrels upon barrels into the mines is a less than enjoyable task that seems potentially easy to fix.
By limiting how much water one can drink?
Some excerpts from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_intoxication:
first observable symptoms of water intoxication: headache, <...> confusion, <...> drowsiness
sometimes followed by difficulty breathing during exertion, muscle weakness & pain, <...> nausea, vomiting, <...>a dulled ability to perceive and interpret sensory information
Both cerebral edema and interference with the central nervous system <...> could result in seizures, brain damage, coma or death.
Sounds like a material for a 3-stage debuff on many stats...

So, how much?
Healthy kidneys are able to excrete approximately 800 millilitres to 1 litre of fluid water (0.84–1.04 quarts) per hour.
Then adding https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perspiration:
Maximum sweat rates of an adult can be up to 2–4 liters per hour or 10–14 liters per day
No other major normal ways to get rid of water, I think?
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Re: Game Development: Harvest Skis

Postby delsus » Fri Oct 22, 2021 8:30 am

Please make the tile harvesting number dependent on the scythe Q. The Q now only matters for the stamina drain, which is barely perceptible.
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Re: Game Development: Harvest Skis

Postby Pommfritz » Fri Oct 22, 2021 9:46 am

Cool update :)
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Re: Game Development: Harvest Skis

Postby wonder-ass » Fri Oct 22, 2021 10:42 am

Consider making mining good again.
  • takes too much energy
  • u need an unreasonable amount of metal to start tunnel mining like 4k+
  • support breaks stupid fucking fast and require nuggets (my fucking inv is literally not big enough to mine for more than 20 mins
  • pls add a support that is like a 1x20 for tunneling
  • Significantly reduce the spawn rate of worms/slimes lvl9 is absurd nobody mines there
  • Add more cave exclusive natural resources to promote exploring cave systems
  • you made slime useless bcs of gelatin
  • pls add a gem detection in to miner credo
  • make it so there is a new tool to excavate boulders instead of them randomly spawning
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Re: Game Development: Harvest Skis

Postby Fostik » Fri Oct 22, 2021 10:47 am

Thanks for the update, happy to see QoL improvements.

Regarding spring - please consider tree cuttings mechanic, this resolves all your concerns regarding realism.
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Re: Game Development: Harvest Skis

Postby Batguano » Fri Oct 22, 2021 11:07 am

Nice patch, thanks!

As for Scythes that now harvest 2x3 tiles: I suggest adding a new tool - Sickle that will harvest 1x1 tiles being as effective as Scythe is (the same speed and Stamina drain). This will be comfortable in some cases, for example when harvesting mixed crop field.

And one IMPORTANT thing: devs, please DON'T make the game TOO simple and casual - many players prefer HARDCORE gameplay, not simplified and casual. Some of the game's aspects should remain being a real challenge.
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Re: Game Development: Harvest Skis

Postby wonder-ass » Fri Oct 22, 2021 11:20 am

There is difference between hardcore difficult and tedious boring. Nothing in haven even remotely resembles hardcore difficulty.
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Re: Game Development: Harvest Skis

Postby ZoddAlmighty » Fri Oct 22, 2021 11:24 am

wonder-ass wrote:Consider making mining good again.
  • 1.takes too much energy
  • 2.u need an unreasonable amount of metal to start tunnel mining like 4k+
  • 3.support breaks stupid fucking fast and require nuggets (my fucking inv is literally not big enough to mine for more than 20 mins
  • 4.pls add a support that is like a 1x20 for tunneling
  • 5.Significantly reduce the spawn rate of worms/slimes lvl9 is absurd nobody mines there
  • 6.Add more cave exclusive natural resources to promote exploring cave systems
  • 7.you made slime useless bcs of gelatin
  • 8.pls add a gem detection in to miner credo
  • 9.make it so there is a new tool to excavate boulders instead of them randomly spawning

Not an expert but as someone who did a fair bit of mining this world (including level 9) I can say:
1.100% true. I had sometimes up to 8 eating sessions just to get my energy back. First couple ones were for stats, other were for just energy at that point.
2. Never have I ever had lack of metal for tunnel supports. Just light a round of smelters every time you go up to replenish energy?
3.That's why you travel with a cart full with wheelbarrows that are topped of with nuggets and bars or just bars if you made crucible on a desired mine level.
4.Sure, streamlining tunneling would be very nice.
5. I agree, I spawned on average 4 packs of slimes/worms when ever I went down to mine. My armor was constantly fucked up because choose to fight them instead of waiting for them to despawn. I just wanna go south, can't blame a man for wanting to go a certain direction :D
6. Yes, 100%.
7. No? Golden cats? Insane curio? I made a conscious effort to collect all the cave slime so we could make it into Golden Cats.
8. I do not know how I feel about it.
9. 100%, boulders are annoying as hell , especially when they start streaking so you get them 4 tiles in a row while you are tunneling.

My addition to this, that would make mining so much more enjoyable overall would be an addition of food that doesn't give stats but does not fill hunger either. That would be the real MVC (most valuable change).
And maybe an indicator of some that you have a tile that could potentially spawn an enemy? Like "Something slithers in the cave" or like that. It would work only on slimes for example, because they are the most prevalent spawn.
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