Why Haven & Hearth isn't popular?

[ydex]

words

agreed, to much basic content is flawed or simply missing.
with huge inlfux of new players game needs to be easier to.. grasp, for them to stay around.

using a semi updated wiki just doesnt cut it :p

[jorb]

agreed, to much basic content is flawed or simply missing.

Oh?

[MagicManICT]

using a semi updated wiki just doesnt cut it

I agree. May I suggest maybe helping with it if you're not happy with it? As far as the amount of updates, I'd like to present you: http://ringofbrodgar.com/wiki/Special:RecentChanges

[ydex]

agreed, to much basic content is flawed or simply missing.

Oh?

Yes. Lots of content feels like it is fixes for previous problems and then reitterated upon, making them not fix the problem and just beeing convoluted and weird.
My primary example is as usual the food mechanics, where satations where added to force ppl to stop spamming one type of food when power leveling. And ofc the point of hunger where that the noobs would have a better chance (or at least the feeling of having a chance) to keep up with more hardcore players. This idea is fine.
Added upon this obv is the salt and drinking mechanics that now instead makes the systems benefit the hardcorers and in fact are punishing only to the noobs. This itteration is not fine if we want to retain and gain alot of new players.

Other flawed elements include; Fated curios, Melee combat moves, Animal AI, Farming, etc.

What I was mainly aiming at when I stated that things are missing was, however, tool tips/guides and QoL things in client. The wiki tings should basicly be avaiable in the client so you don't hae too swamp between them. To relly on a wiki feels very 2005 and is annoying/hard for a majority of modern gamers (kids these days ).
A general tip on the client QoL part could be too play with Amber for a few weeks and then seeing what you like/dislike in it in terms of tuff that just helps players. There is a ton of small things there really, and to have them be options to toggle on or off in default client cant hurt.

With this said let me adress this:

using a semi updated wiki just doesnt cut it

I agree. May I suggest maybe helping with it if you're not happy with it? As far as the amount of updates, I'd like to present you: http://ringofbrodgar.com/wiki/Special:RecentChanges

I do think that you guys who are working on the wiki are doing a great job. I just don't feel like this should be needed in a modern game in the first place.
So, ls, do not feel like I was bashing on the wiki, where in fact I really like the wiki, because without it this game would be unplayable.

[ricky]

@Jorb, if you havent viewed JordanColes' recent feasting video/stream on twitch, you might find it interesting.
to make a long story short, he goes from ~300 strength to ~900 in one session. might be good insight on how folks ab/use satiations, symbel, feasting.

[jordancoles]

agreed, to much basic content is flawed or simply missing.

Oh?

Could start by explaining how to get out of boats and wagons to noobs

[jordancoles]

@Jorb, if you havent viewed JordanColes' recent feasting video/stream on twitch, you might find it interesting.
to make a long story short, he goes from ~300 strength to ~900 in one session. might be good insight on how folks ab/use satiations, symbel, feasting.

Table bonus (101% in my case) + hemp bonus + sub/verification bonus + chair bonus + multiple sations working together such as 125% in 'food,' 'dairy,' and 'cheese' + another 300% fep bonus from the hunger modifier....
It all adds up to INSANE fep gains and bonfires with alts sitting around while your main feasts is the meta. A good bonfire which was lit by a high CHA char can reduce hunger % to like 2% (rich get richer smh).

Anyone with access to wine beer tea and milk can reset and increase all of the satiations that matter with just a little bit of drink grinding (which isn't fun in the slightest way).

Salt doesnt even matter. I have a cupboard and a half of salt but with the bonfire bonus I only had to use 3 pieces in my entire feasting session to stay in the 300% range.
Established players are ALWAYS in the 300% hunger range and it's pointless not to be if you can help it. New players who are buildng and digging are always at 100% or lower unless they use worker alts (not ideal).

Satiations is a tedious mechanic made up of hot garbage. Bonfire bonus is required which puts people without friends/the ability to log on multiple characters at a big disadvantage.

Also a complete lack at stat caps leads to situations that we have right now where there are people with 5000 BASE strength characters and ua/mc which can never be caught up to.
Pls add stat caps of maximum 1000 for combat stats, remove the satiation system entirely and maybe even remove the hunger meter as well because really those things are only hurting new players and no one else

Some clips:
Some feasting and satiation grind
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/179355017

And another clip from the end of the feasting session
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/179355806

[viznew]

iv invited alot of players to game (or to me alot 40-50) some stayed (shout out to biscuit weaver and his crew where ever thay acually are) but alot struggle to start or are not sure how to move forward once got a settlement

some tips at start chould help (hotkeys, quick rundown of credos, learning points and other basics) just like a window that pops up somewhere with like 10 or so pages you can click throu or just straight close (chould be in a help tab some where in menus)

im sure wouldnt do alot but some would def get use from it

start a thread we players chould prob come up with good starter tips (thou 2nd thought looking throu that and picking sounds like a pain lol mabye get mods to help?)

(edit) i guess there already is one technically but thats general tips not noob tips

[MagicManICT]

I do think that you guys who are working on the wiki are doing a great job. I just don't feel like this should be needed in a modern game in the first place.
So, ls, do not feel like I was bashing on the wiki, where in fact I really like the wiki, because without it this game would be unplayable.

It was more a plea for "help please" and was being a bit... shaming? I probably don't do enough myself given the time I have on my hands.

I do agree that there should be more basic information in the game, but you can't have a complex game without some sort of wiki/online manual. It just isn't practical. You can only present so much information to a player at once, and detailed information is impossible to retain for any length of time (unless you're a super-memory type of person).

Could start by explaining how to get out of boats and wagons to noobs

If only I had a dollar for every person that got stuck on this one...

[ricky]

As an aside concerning wiki editting and an in-game manual:

it's super hard to pin down any one mechanic and make a comprehensive guide due to how often mechanics change. You gotta be on your A-game to keep all the mechanic relationships in haven up to date. it's difficult to say "okay, i'm going to rebuild the whole farming guide" only to have the devs in the next update say "crop growth speeds are now variable and local" (I dont think the farming page on the wiki mentions this actually). At that point the guide you made is turned on its head.

This is why I instead mostly focus on keeping item information as accurate as possible and up to date, as well as try to mitigate as much old/outdated information (Fake News) as I can. it took me a long time to think of a graceful way to separate the legacy wiki from the hafen wiki, and an even longer time to find and kill all the redirects back to the legacy wiki (two weeks ago I discovered we didnt have a hafen page for straw). I feel however it's one of the most important steps i've made towards getting the wiki back on its feet.


I'll clarify this isnt a critique of the JLo's development methods, rather just a reason why making a wiki for this game is far more difficult than it may appear.