HnH Needs Adjustment to Wipe Frequency or Progression

[Pal]

It's much more in common with stardew walley in it's best marketable side.

[Robben_DuMarsch]

I mean, that's fair.
If you were to remove all the PvP, it'd more or less be like an MMO of Stardew Valley without any of the scripted events, cute characters, or intuitive tutorial and learning curve. I am not sure how much of a market there is for a super-complex-hard-to-learn Stardew valley though.

Stardew valley is also an offline game that is buy to play, and once you've reached content completion you're sorta finished.

Whereas the only thing separating Haven from being virtually equivalent to Atlas (the ARK mmo conversion) is that it has more content, better MMO infrastructure, less consistent wipe schedule, and a subscription freemium model rather than buy to play.

[Pan_w_okularach]

dgwc

[jock]

Interesting topic, I've read it all.

In my opinion, thing is it's too hard to fix such a niche concept like open PvP sandbox with not really attractive and demanding PvP. Most of such projects live in same life circle: influx of casual players -> mass massacre -> smaller and more hardcore playerbase -> even smaller bored niche playerbase

I believe H&H with quite a small overall tuning (regarding the work already done) could be world 1st crafting/farming cooperative MMO game with potential audience of millions players. Thousands and thousands of people play shitty mmo farms with 1/100 content and quality. H&H even have decent graphics compared to modern indie.

It's about UX and business model actually, not about balance. Also, I respect devs vision, it's their private property after all, if they want to keep gem under pillow.

I think haven is pretty close to that balance with a few more systems it could achieve a fair middle ground. Removing PvP would be bad for haven overall. Raining in the games hermit clubing and strengthening the relationship between kingdoms, warefare and hermits is the areas to focus. Much can be done by way of adjusting existing buffs and extending current systems but we do need more steps in realm creation and an overall mortality/prestige system to counter balance the rushing and value of aimless killing.

[Pal]

I think haven is pretty close to that balance with a few more systems it could achieve a fair middle ground. Removing PvP would be bad for haven overall. Raining in the games hermit clubing and strengthening the relationship between kingdoms, warefare and hermits is the areas to focus. Much can be done by way of adjusting existing buffs and extending current systems but we do need more steps in realm creation and an overall mortality/prestige system to counter balance the rushing and value of aimless killing.

Removing PvP is very flat interpretation of what I've said. You can't just remove it - you'll got different form of griefing. You have to make different structure of what you are selling. More fun and less suffering.

Anyway, if it were easy to understand, it would have been done long ago.

If balance is good - ok, why 200 online then (with probably ~100 unique people, right?)? Then problem is not in balance, but in conception.

People who are still here - they love it. But there are x100 more people who left, who could also play and pay. What they love and why they left? Or did not attracted.

The is no global difference in success in case of investing time and money - 200 or 300 or 400 people online. Difference is 200 or 20000.

And btw with all the money project can get from carebears - you can easily maintain server for people who like current state.

[The_Blode]

Stardew Valley without any of the scripted events, cute characters, or intuitive tutorial and learning curve. I am not sure how much of a market there is for a super-complex-hard-to-learn Stardew valley though.

Don't Starve does okay numbers from what I can gather

[Robben_DuMarsch]

Stardew Valley without any of the scripted events, cute characters, or intuitive tutorial and learning curve. I am not sure how much of a market there is for a super-complex-hard-to-learn Stardew valley though.

Don't Starve does okay numbers from what I can gather

Tbh you're right: https://steamcharts.com/app/322330

[Luno]

If you were to remove pvp, you'd have to add pve shit that can actually challenge the players even inside their walls. Like creatures that can tear down your palisades and invade your village, stuff that would make the game challenging in pve, which is really not the case right now. You'd perhaps have to balance shit like mammoth traps and boat hunting etc etc. Being where we are right now, i honestly think we're a closer to a fun and balanced pvp experience than a pve one.

[noindyfikator]

DST is kind of different game where it mobilizes player to improve skills.

In haven when you die/lose base, you lose all your achievements so..

[Robben_DuMarsch]

I wouldn't want Haven to remove PvP either. But I can't argue it's not similar to an MMO don't starve together.