democracy is a huge circlejerk

[shubla]

You don't vote for a flawed system to make it more flawed because you don't like that it is flawed.

Much logic.
So wow.

Did you read what I wrote earlier in the thread?
1. Most people who vote are not rational about their voting and vote populists and other people who say some cool things, but then do bad things.
2. Voting does not matter, because politicians lie, how should I know who to vote, when I cannot trust that they do what they say?
Thing that annoys me the most are people like you, who think that democracy would be improved by getting more people to vote. Voting is pretty meaningless, because of the two things I mentioned above
Of course, when you vote for example, for some environmentalist party, they probably are not going to like chop all the trees from your country. So with voting you can impact a very small amounts on a small subset of things. But there are many, many things, that you cannot affect, even if you would vote. Such as funding cuts on education apparently!

I guess that the issue with lying politicians would be solved if voters were more rational (because then voters would never vote politicians who lie, resulting in politicians that don't lie s much about things)

Also, I think that most of you should just stop posting to this thread entirely.
Instead of discussing about democracy, and possible flaws of it, you just spam ad hominem in my beautiful thread.

Overall:
75% posts- "op is noob and dick and reason to all our problems"
25% post s- DiCtAtOrShipDoesNtWorK!!!
I never said that it would work if the dictator is a bad guy!
But who is good? Who is evil? Its all quite subjective really.

[Potjeh]

AI dictatorship when?

[shubla]

AI dictatorship when?

Its a cool idea, but:
Even that would require somebody to decide what is optimal thing for the AI to do.
For example, AI could calculate, that it is optimal for economy of a country to kill all disabled people, because they cost the country at lot of money. But many people would probably oppose such thing and try to overrule the AI if it did a such thing.

[Potjeh]

Semi-democracy then. AI makes decisions, people implement them, but there's a delay for people to have a chance to veto AI's decisions. Decisions are posted a couple of months prior to implementation, and if enough people sign a petition against a decision it goes to a referendum and has to get over 50% of votes or it's scrapped.

[MagicManICT]

How much time and effort have you spent researching the subject?
I am sure that there are better alternatives, and there should be public discussion about implementing these alternatives.

I don't know about you, I don't know about anyone else in this thread... but I have, at least at a "non-professional" level, and I can tell you that there is no proposed "better system" other than possibly Marxism, and it's huge flaw is the same one with capitalistic markets and democratic systems: human greed. If we have to contend with that no matter what system, then I'd go with the one more likely to abruptly correct itself with a bumpy ride than the one that is likely to wallow in corruption for decades.

Someone posted a link earlier with the TED Talk about modern China and everything they've done to create a global economic superpower the last 5 decades. Yes, great, and now it's about to be torn down by the party that just built it up. It'll take it less time to fall down, though, and where do you think China will be then? Probably looking to blame the west for their failure.

[MagicManICT]

The whole point of a democratic society, and the US (British colonial Puritans) creating "public education" is to create a more informed citizen, one capable of rational decisions based on facts. Without that, the whole of democracy does collapse into the proverbial idiocracy where the populist leaders will almost always win.

[shubla]

The whole point of a democratic society, and the US (British colonial Puritans) creating "public education" is to create a more informed citizen, one capable of rational decisions based on facts. Without that, the whole of democracy does collapse into the proverbial idiocracy where the populist leaders will almost always win.

You elected a reality-tv billionare who wants to BUILD THAT WALL and MAKE YOUR COUNTRY GREAT AGAIN by DRAINING THE SWAMP!
If that is not populist leader, then what is?
Your education has clearly miserably failed.

Or then democracy just does not work!
People should stop pretending that it works!

[MagicManICT]

Exactly my point. The public education system has failed miserably the last few decades. You know who is looked upon as having one of the best public education systems right now? Finland! And boy do they do some really stupid things there... like not assign homework for kids... I mean, how else are you supposed to teach a child they have to work all day for the sustenance?

[dageir]

We need a meritocracy where all inheritance is banned. When you die, the state gets your stuff.

[shubla]

Exactly my point. The public education system has failed miserably the last few decades. You know who is looked upon as having one of the best public education systems right now? Finland! And boy do they do some really stupid things there... like not assign homework for kids... I mean, how else are you supposed to teach a child they have to work all day for the sustenance?

Finnish education system is not that good really. They just teach different things in Finland which result in being successful when education level is measured by some methods.
Speed of advancement in classes is too slow, because the tempo of the whole class is tempo of the slowest one in class. There are no special schools for more skilled people, which results in lots of lost potential.

In recent years they have also been making some really bad decisions, which probably will soon show up in places like PISA. Or at least I constantly read articles about teachers complaining about various things... For example, people with special needs, and I mean with really special needs, like downs or some other major mental disability are put in same classes as "normal" children, because "they have right to be with their peers". Which results in BOTH the disabled children AND normal children in the class suffering, because they don't get enough time from the teacher. Sizes of classed have increased from around 20 to 40, while amount of teachers/student has decreased, mostly because that saves money. Children are given tablets and laptops to use, and many children who already have problems with focusing to the subject that they are being taught have the temptation to not study with these during class. There are issues with other levels of education as well, for example, I recently read about some teacher who teaches electricians, that he would not want to have any of them do any electrical installations in his home, because they don't get enough teaching from their school to be competent.

I have not studied in other countries than Finland. So maybe I am not competent to compare Finland's system to other countries systems. But my personal opinion of education in Finland is that there is a lot of room for improvement in various things.