At the Crossroads of what is and what could be?

[gravesmerch]

automation is a luxury, the necessity is un-lag my village by hiding models and animations, since every tiny model has its own village of polygons

[sMartins]

I use bots because its been 14 years since I started playing this game and I have real commitments in my life ....

You must check you privilege. A lot of us have been playing for 10+ years and have careers + families now. Logging into a game more than once a day is unreasonable.

Isn't something telling you that maybe it's time to stop wasting time playing video games?
Instead, no, stubborn to the last ... and so you put a computer playing a computer game on your computer ....

Jeez ... how alienated we are ... completely out of reality now.

[DonVelD]

sMartins you're not baiting anyone go do something meaningful with your life

[Pills]

Have you thought about down sizing? FFS this is a game and not your job, If it takes too many hours in the day to do upkeep for your base, wouldn't ya think it's time to downsize?

Tell that to animal breeding RNG. The game literally favours having an absurd amount if you want the Q to raise.

Yet if you would cut your base down say 75%

Then I would have maybe Q50 animals instead of Q200 by time wipe comes around because breeding RNG is awful.

If you honestly think that botting food to feed animals is affecting pvp then you simply do not understand this game, because animals are literally not worth it in quality compared to wild animal hunting unless a world is atleast 2 years long.

How long do you sleep, or am i missing something?

Nobody wants to have to wake up to jump onto a video game to refill a crucible when they also need to get ready for work, sort their kids out etc. How are you not understanding the problem everybody has with steel making?

[sMartins]

sMartins you're not baiting anyone go do something meaningful with your life

I'm not trying to bait anyone, I am saying what I think .... and I'm working, slow day, bored.

[Nocturnal-Rainbows]

Which server would you play? The one char only server or the other server?

The server where you can only play 1 character. It would be the easiest decision of my life.
In fact, when I think on my ideal version of Haven & Hearth, everyone only being able to use 1 character IS that ideal version.

I can't even begin to tell you how much of the game that one change would fix. Industry would be slowed down and the game would progress at a more natural pace. Villages would allocate roles to players, you'd have dedicated chefs, farmers, miners, smiths, hunters and so on.
High end materials which people dedicate alt bots to mass producing would regain a ton of value.
Trading would be more commonplace.

Griefing would be SIGNFIFICANTLY reduced because you're having to do everything on your 1 and only character, there's no sending your alts to do your dirty work. Scout alts would be gone.

World resources (like Salt, Brimstone and Rock Crystals etc) wouldn't be snatched up by people who simply log alts off next to them which log in and auto collect on a timer.

PvP would be more interesting, and victories and losses would be all the more impactful.

There is no aspect of the game that wouldn't be improved substantially by removing the ability to have alts.

[Pills]

World resources (like Salt, Brimstone and Rock Crystals etc) wouldn't be snatched up by people who simply log alts off next to them which log in and auto collect on a timer.

They already removed that 2 worlds ago you can't harvest the same resource twice in a row regardless of timeframe.

you'd have dedicated chefs, farmers, miners, smiths, hunters and so on.

Imagine wanting to play a video game with your friends only to be told "no mate, you can't play the game how you want, you HAVE to do all the farming for all of us because you're the only person who hasn't statted for it yet so that's where your stats are going because WE need it fuck you".

Alts are not bad, game mechanics are.

fwiw: i'm aware some people like to dedicate to a sole purpose in games like this, but that's not everyone, and that's certainly not hermits. removing alts punishes all the solo/duo/trio players significantly more than it will ever even remotely touch the larger villages.

[DonVelD]

It's good to have fantasies but it's all they are. In reality, one char one person won't work, just like communism.

[Nocturnal-Rainbows]

They already removed that 2 worlds ago you can't harvest the same resource twice in a row regardless of timeframe.

World Resource alts are so low maintenance and easy to make that there's nothing stopping you from putting a second alt at them.

Imagine wanting to play a video game with your friends only to be told "no mate, you can't play the game how you want, you HAVE to do all the farming for all of us because you're the only person who hasn't statted for it yet so that's where your stats are going because WE need it fuck you".

Do you say the same about the need for healers in other games? Or tanks? Or dedicated buffers? If a village wants maximum efficacy, then I don't see any issue whatsoever with them assigning out roles. Also, for the record, having one of your villagers go the farmer route doesn't mean they need to be confined to the base doing that one thing. You're twisting things because you're comparing it to how dedicated farmers are currently handed, aka throwaway alts that log in, harvest then plant the crops then log off.
The guy handling farming can do other shit but he's going to need to at minimum up his farming skill and do the farming credo. That's all I meant by assigning roles.

I hermit, I can have 1 character that does everything. Farming, mining, hunting, carpentry, masonry, cooking, everything. If hermits can do that, other villages who assign roles can still have those characters with their assigned role do other things. If your farmer also does fighting to take part in PvP and hunting (which is reasonable) that's fine.
The issue is people don't want to risk their industry characters, they want safe industry characters locked up behind walls so that they can use them to kit out the one fighter character they do make, which is bullshit to begin with.

And one final thought. The game shouldn't be made worse because people who have played it for 10+ years don't want to/can't log in as much. Any other game where this happens, you fall behind. Shit happens, you can't expect to reap the rewards of having the best industry and fighter character without putting the work in, that's completely antithesis of what Haven & Hearth stands for. The thing that used to set this game apart from others is that every accomplishment you make feels earned after the labour you've put into it unlike other games which have watered themselves down to giving the player everything for minimal investment.
That all goes out the fucking window when everybody just uses a combination of automated bots and alts to do everything for them.

People have fucking diluted this once great, complex and deep game down to just being about quickly getting a fighting character up and running ASAP and going around fighting other players at the expense of all other aspects of the game and they do this by using alts and bots.

This is a game where the journey is far superior to the destination, but people keep shitting out alts to bot industry and everything else for them and they wonder why they're bored with nothing to do.

Do you know how many times I've heard the argument "B-b-but I don't have time to do all this stuff I just want to have my PvP ready character without putting in the work, I need muh bots and alts "? You ever cheated in a game? I have. Got bored of grinding, felt I had earned that item which just seemingly wouldn't drop, so I just downloaded an inventory editor and gave it to myself. Then I start grinding again for another item and at the back of my head all I can hear is "Why are you doing this, you're going to get the item eventually anyway, you've got the inventory editor, just use it again, what's the big deal? It's just saving yourself some time :^)". There's no satisfaction from cheating, no accomplishment and pretty soon that feeling of instant gratification disappears too and then the game cannot be viewed as anything other than a waste of time because that is all games are when you unravel them.
>NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO I NEED MY FARM BOT, I NEED MY CHEESE BOT, I NEED MY FEAST BOT, I NEED MY SCOUT BOT, THEY'RE NOT BAD THEY'RE JUST STOPPING ME FROM WASTING MY TIME
Every fucking game is a waste of time. There is no point to any of this shit if you view it that way. This is a pointless exercise. We are ALL whiling away our finite time before the grave to play this shit.

Yeah, my bad man, I suppose I should just watch a fucking AI play the game for me rather than playing it myself. Alts being everywhere making the game a fucking objectively worse place? Well, so long as they help get my fighting character to endgame so I can have maybe 1 decent PvP fight per world with another player who also bots and alts as much as me it's all worth it.

[Audiosmurf]

I find you shrill and annoying and some of your takes are dogshit but you're so fucking based (this take is not dogshit, but the "combat should just be standing there!" one was)