What You Have Eat for Supper?

[sMartins]

If you want to eat meat substitutes that are breaded or full of salt then you might pay a little more in some cases, but a steak will cost you $14-20+ here at minimum and none of the tofu products I've seen go over that price.

Yeah but probably those things cost way less to produce than meat .... well, I don't know that much about those things so better I don't talk but I'm also pretty sure there was/is some kind of attempt from the industry to turn the table in favor of these new products ... and trust me it's not cause they care about animals.

[jordancoles]

If you want to eat meat substitutes that are breaded or full of salt then you might pay a little more in some cases, but a steak will cost you $14-20+ here at minimum and none of the tofu products I've seen go over that price.

Yeah but probably those things cost way less to produce than meat .... well, I don't know that much about those things so better I don't talk but I'm also pretty sure there was/is some kind of attempt from the industry to turn the table in favor of these new products ... and trust me it's not cause they care about animals.

Well obviously a business would want to promote it's products, and if there's a health edge they can exploit or if they have the chance to knock their competitors of course they'll take it. I wouldn't really blame a company that makes meat substitutes if they tried to put themselves under the spotlight. Specially when eating meat is the norm while they're mostly catering to a niche market rn

[linkfanpc]

I've talked with family about setting up a chicken coop. We're in the city, and we can have up to 8 birds for eggs or butchering. Rabbit is great, too. Urban farming! Grow some!!

As a previous owner of chickens, i can safely say they are absolutely amazing to have around. Not only do they make great outdoor pets, home-grown eggs taste SO much better than store-bought ones.

Although, a few warnings: They poop quite a lot. If you're gonna keep them in a coop, it'll need to be cleaned once or twice per month. If you'll let them outside, be prepared for poop in a couple places you'd rather it not be, like on your porch. They very rarely poop on, like, your car or something. Just on places they hang out a lot, and mine hung out on the porch a lot, since they liked watching us from outside.

And, contrary to popular belief, roosters do not only crow in the morning. Also they usually get pretty mean when they get old, so be prepared to out a couple down.

Also, they can get a tad over-bearing if you have food. Usually they just hover around you, eating any scraps you drop, though sometimes they might try to jump up and steal it. They like dry and/or crumbly stuff like tortilla chips, crackers, bread, etc.

They actually can be great pets. They're really easy to make friendly, just hold and pet them once or twice per day when they're young. They'll get attached to you quick. Although it can depend on the breed. It's nice to have two or three little chickens following you around for a reason other than you having food.

[jordancoles]

To start (since it's short, and loftar mentioned): gluten free baking is usually about using binder substitutes like flax to hold the bread together. There's some tricks, but once you learn them, you can convert almost any recipe to gluten free. Until then, the Internet is great for finding recipes. Some of the foods are actually better (brownies being one), some don't come out so well (actual cakes aren't quite so good... not as light and fluffy, or pick up an odd flavor from the other binders). Give it a try and see what you like. Overall it tends to be healthier because of the grains being used (not because it's gluten-free).

I don't really see a point in the gluten movement. There are some select people that legitimately can't have gluten because of health reasons but just removing gluten in general? I think the positive effects are mostly in your head in that case (It might help if you have IBS/Crohn's, but I'd still try a plant-based diet first)

One thing that I immediately noticed when I stopped eating meat was that literally everywhere you go to eat, there will be a gluten-free option (or three) for people to choose from, but most places don't have any vegetarian/vegan options on their menus. I was pretty surprised to find that one out, but now I realize why my fiancee never used to want to go out to eat anywhere. Paying extra to eat at a restaurant and getting a salad you could've made at home for way cheaper sorta takes the fun out of it after a while

When you really start to look around you you realize there's meat in almost every meal in North America. People are constantly finding new and exciting ways to jam-pack bacon bits into things
Once you decide that it's not in you to keep eating animals, you really start to view the society around you in a different way. I think the culture shock of realizing how much meat is actually being consumed and harvested around you on a daily basis is the cause for a lot of those "new vegans." The ones who are in everyone's face about it and the ones who are the focus of all the bad vegan stereotypes. Most vegans/vegetarians are just trying to not be dicks (in general) and to not die young

edits fukkin typos

[Ysh]

If God do not want me to eat animal, He will not make animal out of tasty meat. I do not think this question of eat animal is some ethics dilemma. Certain, it is no good to torture some animal for no reasons, but there is no need to torture this animal to harvest meat. Fact that some men will torture this animal is unfortunate, but it is no relation to eat meat.

[MagicManICT]

Well, when George Burns died at 100 and was never seen without a lit cigar and was well known for his diet of meat and potatoes, I gave up on this whole "do it because it's good for you." What's good for one isn't always good for another, what's bad for most probably isn't going to bother some. Just know your family history. If there's a history of everyone dying by 70, good chance there's some bad habits you shouldn't follow, be it drinking, tobacco, diet, whatever. At least... if you want to live long enough to enjoy watching your grandkids have their own children. Then again, as the average age of child birth* seems to be going up... still probably not going to happen.

As far as the restaurants, I know what you mean. More are starting to offer something, but we've learned where we can go and not go. But when it comes to the meals at restaurants... well, they're all about 3-4x food cost markup. It's just the rule to pay for prep and service and have enough left for a decent profit. If you're paying $15-20 for a steak dinner, I guarantee that isn't a $5 cut of meat at the butcher shop... more like $2-3.


*Completely off topic: Read an odd study many years ago about researchers that pushed back aging in certain lower lifeforms like fruit flies by pushing back the age at which the animals were allowed to first breed. The fruit flies went from an average lifespan of a day to over three months. Certain other animals that had shorter lifespans saw them more than double in the lab during the several years of this research. There was speculation about this possibly promoting longer lives in higher organisms, too, but higher order animals generally have more complicated metabolisms, too, and more factors for natural causes of death.

[shubla]

To start (since it's short, and loftar mentioned): gluten free baking is usually about using binder substitutes like flax to hold the bread together.

Gluten-free baking sounds very difficult, as if I have understood correctly, gluten is what makes dough dough.

2.In Hinduism, all live without red meat, as it's better to milk a cow than to kill it... or any mammal for that matter. It's a tenet of the religion few are willing to break. Some Buddhists have been living as vegans for almost as long as Buddhism has existed (1600+ years).

There would not be enough meat for all hindus if they would decide to start eating meat daily. So they really can not start eating meat either. I dont think that you should call people that dont eat meat because of their religion vegans.
In hinduism, meat eating is not really prohibited, but just discouraged. Only 1/3 of hindus or so do not eat meat at all. Cow is exception to this, as cows are holy.

Let's also mention that animal farming is one of the biggest producers of free methane on the planet with no way of trapping it short of more factory farming methods (which are bad, both from a humane perspective and nutritional value of the animal as food), and that methane is upwards of 86x as dangerous as CO2.

We must also remember that methane is not that bad greenhouse gas, as it only affects in the atmosphere for about 12 years. Compared to CO2, which stays in the atmosphere for a much longer time, hundreds of years.
Theres also lot of methane trapped in Siberia, under the ice in the ground. If this ice melts, it will all be released into the atmosphere, causing great warming globally, way more than what we have experienced so far. But as a Finn, I would be more worried about shutting down of the gulf stream, which would cause ice-age in Finland and scandinavia.

It wouldn't be nice to think about? That must be so hard for you

I mean, that many things are ethically wrong. For example the clothes that I am wearing have not been produced very ethically, can not know that for sure, but it is very likely. Same with all the other things such as electronics.

I'd rather be informed about what I'm directly supporting instead of turning a blind eye to it or choosing to live in a bubble. When you buy a slab of meat you are telling the store and their sources that their slaughter practices are acceptable to you and that you want more. When enough people buy and tell the company they need more stock, the scale increases and they get sloppier in how they treat the animals.

I have seen some high quality Finnish documents of animal slaughter and mutilating. I am still ok with the practices that they use and buy meat.
Am I directly supporting child labor if I wear clothes that have been made by children in some poor country?
Am I directly supporting the horrible work environments that humans have in some of the poor countries, where the minerals to make my computers and components are dug out?
We soon find out that I can not use any products or objects, if I dont justify some unethical things involved in producing them.


About antibiotics in domesticated animals. It is American problem yet again, in Finland, we do not feed out animals with antibiotics (except if the animals are sick and really need them). I would be worried about humans use of antibiotics as well. Many people do not eat all the antibiotics that were given to them, or eat antibiotics in situations where you would not need them. This is very common especially in poor countries where people dont understand how antibiotics work, and why they dont work on for example viruses.

[MagicManICT]

I should have said "red meat," implying beef as poultry is common. I get to thinking faster than typing and forget to correct my mental shorthand. Apologies.

Gluten-free baking sounds very difficult, as if I have understood correctly, gluten is what makes dough dough.

It's not difficult, just different, and yes, those wheat starches are what turn into gluten making bread bread, but there are more types of bread than that.

We must also remember that methane is not that bad greenhouse gas, as it only affects in the atmosphere for about 12 years. Compared to CO2, which stays in the atmosphere for a much longer time, hundreds of years.

But it is... it's the worst. The only other atmospheric pollutant worse than methane is sulfur emissions as acidic rains ruin crops and increase the costs of maintaining cities and infrastructure.

[shubla]

We must also remember that methane is not that bad greenhouse gas, as it only affects in the atmosphere for about 12 years. Compared to CO2, which stays in the atmosphere for a much longer time, hundreds of years.

But it is... it's the worst. The only other atmospheric pollutant worse than methane is sulfur emissions as acidic rains ruin crops and increase the costs of maintaining cities and infrastructure.

You have to think about things overall, not only some parts of them. Sure it causes more greenhouse effect than CO2, but CO2 stays in the atmosphere for a much longer time, resulting in bigger effect in the long run, methane quickly dissolves.

Lets take nuclear waste for example.
The worry is not about it being immediately dangerous to the vicinity, but it stays dangerous for very, very long time. Which is a problem.

[PastTime]

I'm surprised nobody brought halal meat into this conversation.