The State of Combat

[VDZ]

You're probably not that familiar with mmorpg's so I'm here to tell you that every mmorpg is using skills that you can place on a hotbar instead of a card/deck system.
Seeing that this system is so widespread among mmorpgs I can guarantee you that the average beginner will find this far more familiar, and the average player will find it far less restricting.

Fair enough argument, but that doesn't necessarily mean that its right for Haven. Also, if you look at more current mmorpg's, you'll see that most are moving away from this type of combat. Blade and Soul, Black Desert, Guild Wars 2, all pretty recent successful games without hotbar combat.

Plus, in the games with hotbar combat, the skills have cooldowns instead of IP requirements; if they do have resource requirements it's a single universal mana-like bar which starts at full and regenerates rapidly (or can be refilled rapidly with items), not something that starts at 0 and needs to be built up in combat. In other words, in those games you can be sure those skills will all be usable until something happens to render them unusable (so it's useful to have immediate access to them from the start of combat), which is the opposite of Haven where you always have to consider when a move is actually usable.

[psyknx]

You're probably not that familiar with mmorpg's so I'm here to tell you that every mmorpg is using skills that you can place on a hotbar instead of a card/deck system.
Seeing that this system is so widespread among mmorpgs I can guarantee you that the average beginner will find this far more familiar, and the average player will find it far less restricting.

Fair enough argument, but that doesn't necessarily mean that its right for Haven. Also, if you look at more current mmorpg's, you'll see that most are moving away from this type of combat. Blade and Soul, Black Desert, Guild Wars 2, all pretty recent successful games without hotbar combat.

Plus, in the games with hotbar combat, the skills have cooldowns instead of IP requirements; if they do have resource requirements it's a single universal mana-like bar which starts at full and regenerates rapidly (or can be refilled rapidly with items), not something that starts at 0 and needs to be built up in combat. In other words, in those games you can be sure those skills will all be usable until something happens to render them unusable (so it's useful to have immediate access to them from the start of combat), which is the opposite of Haven where you always have to consider when a move is actually usable.

Actually. Traditional mmorpgs have combat recources that are called rage (WoW I believe) for example, or since rye brought up Blade and Soul(hotbar game), chi/energy which might as well all be called IP.
You build these recources with shitty skills in order to use your good skills.

Guess Haven isn't so original after all huh.

Anyways, I think this "mmorpgs vs haven" is derailing the discussion a bit so I'll leave it at that.

[Thedrah]

does ua vs mc on defence vs offense equal? does a sting on 100mc against 100ua not go through a quick dodge? or does the sword quality affect the weight of the attack greatly?

Mc's attack weight is averaged with the vitality of their weapon. Their agility is averaged with the essence (might be switched). Therefore the sting doesn't go through the quick dodge unless their sword is higher than q100. Any damage caused by that sting going through is likely negligible do to armor blocking it.

that is quite interesting imo, makes mc more defensive than ua. shield up has that multiplier while sword q softcaps weight of the attack

i could see someone only defending blue/yellow and with decent armor would beet most opponents. ua is defeated severely when armor enters and mc only needs blue (maybe yellow if they use chop)

although if i fought myself, i think i could defeat myself using ua even with armor. i only have 50 absorption and i deal 80+ damage with knock its teeth out. might take awhile but would break armor and knock its teeth out has a short cd of 35 comparatively... i would think armor level is 80+ for most players with metal. i should figure out how much str and cutthroat knuckles helps the damage... although ua only has an advantage with speed but at the cost of complexity