HnH Needs Adjustment to Wipe Frequency or Progression

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HnH Needs Adjustment to Wipe Frequency or Progression

Postby Robben_DuMarsch » Wed Feb 21, 2024 3:11 am

It takes about 9 weeks for PvE progression to be played through entirely.
By this point, dedicated miners have so much strength (1.5k+) that they don't need to get any more strength, and industry progression becomes bulk bone production (finding high level animal nodes and farming them with spawner bots), and bulk iron for spiraling. Both need to be in such ridiculous qualities that unless you're fully botting and/or fully unemployed, you may as well stop progressing.

The majority of early game content becomes completely obsolete, and non-industry endgame content starts to rely on automated/botted production (massive farming/milk/cheese operations where a few botters feed an entire faction and an army of animals), and there's a real breakdown in the game's rapid shift to a few basic tasks done to near infinity, which simply isn't fun.

Frankly, this is how virtually all survival crafting games tend to end in the endgame, and it's not an indictment of Haven and Hearth or Jorb/Loftar. Although it may be conceptually possible to create an endgame where there is more staying power in the endgame, the amount of development resources and experimentation necessary to accomplish that end is far too great for our devs who are part-timing this (without blame on them, they've done so much for 2 people.)

Haven should really consider embracing 3 month wipe cycles, but also reduce the necessary time commitment, such as by cutting all credo quest progression cost in half, making progression easier but increasing hunger time gating to allow faster progression with less consumption but stop that from creating ultra-beefy characters too quickly, and make some other adjustments to account for the reduced life cycle (kingdom timers should be quicker or expansion should be unrestricted etc).

Then, if this is successful, the game should be launched on Steam to both increase the player population and to make Jorb and Loftar good money.
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Re: HnH Needs Adjustment to Wipe Frequency or Progression

Postby darma » Wed Feb 21, 2024 8:53 am

Niiice. You are so smaaaart and talk such nice words.

So, I think there are two possible situations:

1. You have access to a client not available to all users, capable of a lot of botting and this helps you a lot. And because you do not really use your brain cells you think you are entitled to changes in the game to make you feel good, because "everybody can do what I do and I am already bored"
or
2. I really do not know how to search this forum or discord.
In this case it would be a great help for me and for promoting your wishes to show me the way to 1.5k strength in 2 months.
I promise I will support your ideas if you can show me the way

What would it be?
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Re: HnH Needs Adjustment to Wipe Frequency or Progression

Postby Robben_DuMarsch » Wed Feb 21, 2024 9:43 am

darma wrote:In this case it would be a great help for me and for promoting your wishes to show me the way to 1.5k strength in 2 months.
I promise I will support your ideas if you can show me the way

What would it be?


Sure, I'll share the "secret" of faction competitive industry.

I don't bot beyond using an auto-spawner for animals and the regular "bots" or scripts available on ardennes, which are available for anyone.
Admittedly, the angler and mammoth spawners are less public, but any village playing competitively has them as a matter of necessity.

You need faction grade recipes, a stable of active players supporting your miner(s), and your miner character(s) needs to be dedicated to mining.
Here's an example of one such recipe:
Image
Here's another:
Image

You bulk produce these and other such recipes, put it on a table with good symbel, and eat it whenever your satiations are below X%. Your symbels should look like this or better less than a month after world up, when you get silver:
Image
Note, this isn't even gold, which is even more broken.

Your top miner is also given salt to even more aggressively push their strength.

You should have several hunters for every miner in the early world - Although this becomes less important as the world progresses. If your group is particularly tight knit, you may wish to consider all jointly having access to a dedicated mining character that you can all utilize and force feed together. You also need players dedicated to other components of quality spiraling, like tree quality which is important for bough production, which is important for pickaxe quality. You also need at least 1 good dedicated support crafter, who will do curios, tailoring, and gem socketing.
Your rings should look like these, which I looted off of Felix about 2 months after world start:
Image


If you want to play past 9 weeks and maintain top tier quality, you'll also need a group of very autistic people to farm a quest giver to infinitely spiral animal quality so that your bones for your bone clay will always be equal to your cutting tool.
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Re: HnH Needs Adjustment to Wipe Frequency or Progression

Postby darma » Wed Feb 21, 2024 10:10 am

Thanks for the info,

Now all I have to do is make Ardennes work for me (could not do that and gave up trying to use clients/scripts that do work only sometimes and only if you know how to compile them for your system and make the available scripts work too) , then find a "stable of active players" to support my miner. Weird is that my list of friends right now is three persons long and only one sometimes talks to me . All the other neighbours refused to kin and run away as soon as I appear on the map and of course I tend to do that too if I am not behind a pali.

"a table with good symbel" should have not been mentioned but I will definetly do orcas and salt ready for food mass production.

If you do not get it, this was irony.

If you get it you understand that you seem to choose option nr 1: you have a special case of environment : clients, bots, knowledge about how to make them work, a lot of active players behind you. And you think that everybody has easy access to this and because you got bored the game should be changed.

I must recognize you are polite (not like me :(, in my defense I am frustrated with this kind of posts ).

If you really are bored please try the experience of most other users:
- start new character
- use Ender client or some other that works on most of the computers and does not need a lot of programming knowledge ( I find confusing even the Java SDK JRE version that I should have to make more than one client work )
- try to make new friends to have a working village
- try to get to 1.5k Strength

Do you really think you would succeed?
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Re: HnH Needs Adjustment to Wipe Frequency or Progression

Postby Robben_DuMarsch » Wed Feb 21, 2024 10:13 am

Ya because I'd just join a village (Whatever Bay, the village I am apart of, is literally public/open recruitment) and not do everything myself. :D
Hermitting is hard work. There are absolutely economies of scale, and the game is a lot easier when you have others to rely on.
But as long as a village like Whatever Bay exists, you don't need an existing group of friends to plug into to play competitively - There are "public" options, so to say.
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Re: HnH Needs Adjustment to Wipe Frequency or Progression

Postby darma » Wed Feb 21, 2024 10:20 am

you really mean that I can join right now Whatever Bay village and I will get everything (clients, help with using them and the bots, table with symbel , mass produced food, salt) and should not pay for this? Only play the few hours I have available?
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Re: HnH Needs Adjustment to Wipe Frequency or Progression

Postby Robben_DuMarsch » Wed Feb 21, 2024 10:27 am

Right now there are 279 people online (how many are bots?)
I think you'd find a lot more help earlier in the world, when there is more activity among the players. If you joined now, you might get some basic help. If you wanted to take part in the big push towards industry, you'd need to be there around wipe day, when people are more active....

Which is why I made this thread :D
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Re: HnH Needs Adjustment to Wipe Frequency or Progression

Postby darma » Wed Feb 21, 2024 10:52 am

It seems the short answer is "No".
I should have started around wipe day and "wanted to take part in the big push towards industry", by this I understand willing to put a lot of hours in the game.

Unfortunatelly (or fortunatelly considering that gaming addiction is not the best thing people should have) I could not do the first and can not do the second.
For players like you your suggestion might be good. I was almost considering to be definetly good before I asked myself how many of those 3 months cycles would you do before getting bored.
For players like me your suggestion would totally destroy the game since in those three months even if I join a village, since I can not always start from the beginning and since I can not put your hours, I will definetly not grow much until wipe.

Going now to domesticate a boar for that nice Autumn Steak recipe
Orcas will have to wait
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Re: HnH Needs Adjustment to Wipe Frequency or Progression

Postby DonVelD » Wed Feb 21, 2024 7:44 pm

*burps loudly* nuh uh
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JOIN THE OFFICIAL H&H DISCORD TODAY
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Re: HnH Needs Adjustment to Wipe Frequency or Progression

Postby jock » Wed Feb 21, 2024 10:27 pm

Haven is well-designed for a small private community game as an MMO it comes down to botting or no lifeing :D
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