safepali change

[SnuggleSnail]

#1 there are still methods for people with rage to use safepalis (that were pointed out prior to the visitor gate change) which feels a bit dumb, and gay, and fake, and silly, and stinky. I assume this is non-controversially seen as bad, and will be fixed after 5-10 years of complaints.

#2 people without rage getting access to stronger than world 10 safepalis everywhere across the entire map. Its been rly fkn annoying and unfun for me, but that's not necessarily an argument for it being bad for the game. I think it's very easy to make a persuasive argument it's bad for PVP, though. I'm just gonna list some things about it that feel very stinky to me, so carebears can screech about me just wanting to kill hermits

Objective things that are definitely happening I think most people agree are bad:

• Fighters are already doing that world 11 shit where they just block you, drive snekkjas, and be annoying without rage hoping for you to aggro them
• Most if not all people from large villages (Fire&Ice, Edgeville, Civitas, Maze's village, Jock's villae, the BRs, etc) are choosing not to get rage
• I believe in most cases the aforementioned villages aren't buying rage because it's powerful to do so, not because it's fun or they're just harmless li'l guys
• People from my own village are choosing to not get rage, and I think we can all agree people from my village do not fucking deserve new player protection
• Crafters, miners, alts, support characters (most characters) etc from big PVP villages get the new player protection
• There are rly fucking bad incentives to siege on characters with no rage and aggro off of Pclaim
• There are rly strong/bad incentives to have characters without rage for siege defense

Subjective conclusions:

• People who would typically buy rage and fight to some extent (people like Sozin, LoseXD), but aren't "primarily" playing to fight are discouraged from participating because buying rage would permanently """ruin""" their character
• New people are going to be discouraged from buying rage and getting into PVP
• Basically everybody from big villages full of people who have 10 years of experience get the new player protection, which feels stinky and against the spirit of the game for me - but reasonable people could definitely disagree
• You're griefing yourself if you buy rage on a mining character which feels incredibly bad as mining characters are typically fighters in bigboi villages

I think the change has been "somewhat" effective in protecting hermits. Instead of dunking 99% of the hermits I see, it might be down to like 90% now. That's partially due to the fact that early world you mainly find people near their bases, but it's certainly not literally nothing like the normal gate system.

To reiterate, I don't feel confident saying it's objectively bad for the game overall, but man it feels boring/against the spirit of the game to me. I think it's obviously due to 3 continents + less people as well, but I've never had a world where as little interesting PVP-esque stuff has happened. Guess if it's good or not mainly depends on the dev's vision for the game.

[Halbertz]

I have mixed feelings about this too. On the one hand, the game has become much more friendly to the mentally challenged, who previously couldn't run five tiles to a palisade. On the other hand, as with most changes, veterans are taking full advantage of this mechanic, turning the game into an even gayer version of it.
I haven't noticed the stench on forums or discord yet, but it will soon rise, as there are several variations of safe palisades that evoke deja vu similar to the famous cave near WB in the world 15.

[SnuggleSnail]

tbh should probably start by asking for the non-controversial stuff to be fixed, but I suspect the intended mechanics will end up being just as annoying as the oversights




I rly strongly feel you should have to risk something to engage in PVP, and it's boring/against the spirit of the game to be able to make yourself intrinsically safe

[The_Blode]

the mentally challenged, who previously couldn't run five tiles to a palisade.

[Dawidio123]

I unironically do think ppl without rage shouldn't be able to use any offensive moves against another player, let them only defend but if someone wants to be able to attack and actually fight with another player they should be required to get rage with the current safepalis.
But also making rage something that inherently nerfs your character is just a feel bad mechanic (also no confirmation on buying rage so imagine miss-clicking it by accident and now you have to drown yourself)

[Audiosmurf]

It's a tradeoff, not a nerf. I think this is the best shot they've taken at balancing out the viking vs. non-viking players.

[Rebs]

Yeah I am not gonna lie I didn't pick rage due to it being kinda over powered and I am suddenly realising I am having less fun the normal because I don't seek out pvp anymore. Its basically kinda forced me to play pve which is just isn't fun and I know I could get rage but it feels so horrible to do, none of my village has it and everyone is getting Zzz of 16.1 making curios 24/7 for no reason, when at least pvp was that reason before.. ill end up getting it and then getting ganked outside my walls I swear.

[VDZ]

I unironically do think ppl without rage shouldn't be able to use any offensive moves against another player, let them only defend but if someone wants to be able to attack and actually fight with another player they should be required to get rage with the current safepalis.

That's unreasonable. I should not be required to get Rage to avoid being followed by some 20 UA troll alt that keeps giving me openings so I can't fight animals properly, or even just keeps me from hearthing home during a Thingwall or Whirlpool journey.

Why not just debuff PvP damage (or hell, effective UA/MC even) for players who don't have Rage? It's reasonable that people regularly engaging in PvP, even defensively, should get Rage, but for just ending someone's attack against you without going home you should not be required to have a 50k LP skill that serves no purpose for you and also keeps you from walking back into your base while in combat with an animal.

[Luno]

I got rage cause i wanted siegecraft.
Death or glory my beloved.

[SnuggleSnail]

Make not having rage more punishing

There's isn't a any reasonable penalty that will convince most people, even from big villages, even from PVP villages, to get rage. Most people optimize their entire game around survival. Being completely safe in a survival game sucks, but people are going to optimize the fun out of the game if they're allowed to.

Personally, I think everybody except the spruciest sprucecaps shouldn't have this level of protection, but I really can't think of a way to programmatically distinguish genuine new players.

I doubt there's some clever half measure way to protect the nabs without making a system tryhards will abuse. The game needs to decide if it wants to be "We specialize in permadeath and forum drama." the MMO, or farmville. The compromises always seem to just end up with nobody happy.