Most changes to hunting since w8 have been terrible

[springyb]

The alternative of being able to craft a q10 sling with 20 MM and have your first animal you kill be q300 doesn't make for good long term game play either. Group hunting is basically the same issue because only one person needs enough combat stats to create openings. Give your new players a sword and have them chop whenever there's an opening, it doesn't require any LP into combat just a few discoveries and works well. Requiring survival offers at least something resembling progression. I also think that without the survival cap, max animal quality would have to be lowered and that would really suck because without 300q bears average players will never have high quality animal parts unless they start exploiting end game stuff.

You're glossing over the fact that even if you kill a q300 animal, without a q300+ cutting tool and 300+ survival you would still be lowering the quality significantly. It's not like 1 ua 1 mc 1 survival noob with a sword that wanders into an animal node will be rolling in high quality materials instantly. The progression comes from grinding out the cutting tool and the butcher character. The butcher doesn't necessarily have to be the hunter as well.

I was speaking more of what it would be like if survival didn't hard cap, but yes I do agree. I think it's counter productive to have animals hardcapped by survival and then soft capped by resources that have nothing to do with survival. Which is one of the reasons why I'm a fan of a skinning tool made from animal bones.

I also did not know survival caps animals twice, once when killing and again while butchering. I've always butchered my own animals so I've never noticed, it really should only be one or the other.

[magisticus]

Agree that we would be better with basic qualities based on the type of animal. It is not good for the game that top groups can get hold of huge amounts of high q bones from the off, just leads to massive increase of quality at the start of the game. Game would be more interesting if it took longer to get the first 100 or 200 levels of quality. Bones also have too large an affect in general (saw, glue, compost, bone clay etc), perhaps if this was reduced by introducing latter game manufactured versions of some of these things alongside halving the quality affect of ones created with bones (particularly glue) the impact would be less significant. I would also prefer it if domesticated meat and bones had a chance of catching up with top quality earlier and actually impacting the game a bit more.

I think it would be quite cool if the highest quality wild bone you could get would be 100 - but this would have to be next world.

Disagree with removing the armor on animals - I think this was a sensible change that adds a little challenge to the initial developement.

I also think it was generally a good move that survival affects the quality of the animal, means that hunters have to have some level of developement rather than being mass produced and potential opening up more potential for botting.

I also did not know survival caps animals twice, once when killing and again while butchering. I've always butchered my own animals so I've never noticed, it really should only be one or the other.

It only caps twice if the person butching has lower survival than the person that killed the animal (as it is a hardcap when killing the animal and a softcap when butchering). I don't see that this should ever be a problem as you would normally take your animals home to butcher and then surely the person with highest survival would do that job anyway unless severe muppetry is at play.

[jorb]

> most changes
> cites three

Myeah, idk, bub.

[shubla]

> most changes
> cites three

Myeah, idk, bub.

List changes that you think were good so he can tell why they are not.

[Lightning2]

I don't really care much about 1 and 3 but definitely nr 2 has been bugging me a bit. I'm doing a ton of hunting and I prefer to take some of the newer players around but they just have to sit tight if they join in.

Perhaps some animals could transition to a combat deck with aoe moves when there's more around? To prevent the low level alt spam, so you would still need to block and get some OK armor on them

[shubla]

Yea animal qualities should be random and not location specific or locations should shift weekly or such.

Hard cap thing is just dumb, if its made to prevent bug hunting you have failed terribly.

Armor thing is also just unnecessary.

Animals run away too fast so that only way to kill them is to abuse bugs basically.

All easy fixes but devs refuse to make easy fixes instead they will wait another 5 years and then come up with some completely new system that no one wanted which will just be more problems like they always have done.

[jordancoles]

> most changes
> cites three

Myeah, idk, bub.

List changes that you think were good so he can tell why they are not.

Yeah, I wanna hear the good reasons lol

[Zentetsuken]

Nodes are the biggest problem imo

I have suggested various ways that animal nodes could relocate, drift and change over the last couple years to no avail

Survival hardcapping doesn't seem like a big deal because as bmjclark said, you can just gild yourself to 300 surv in like 2 weeks no problem

Armour doesn't bother me too much, I know it was meant to stop people from cheesing bigboi animals within the first week but if it didn't accomplish this I'm sure there could be another way to force the gating of bigger animals

I think that all the cheesing and "unfairness" of realm villages being able to pull in a steady source of q300+ bones would be turned on its head with animal nodes resetting every couple weeks, it really makes zero sense that animals would stay in the same place without migrating away from common hunting grounds

Another thing that could make noobs more actively involved in hunting, if this is even necessary, would be to bring back quality inspection, even if it's something like auroch hair for every animal it could be useful, especially combined with shifting nodes

[Archiplex]

one of the things i hate about animals, which i think was supposed to have been fixed back in w8 but never was, is that animal nodes are stagnant. once you find an extremely high quality node, you have to keep going back to that spot to check for that high quality animal; this is particularly disgusting with anglers where people literally have bots that log into caves to check if there's an angler for an infinite source of mega high ql materials (yes, the alternative of checking that spot every 20 minutes isnt that fun either, but the problem is that the spawn can be farmed to begin with)

i think the surv hardcap can be removed without seriously harming the game; people cheese it either ways, and it removes the fun of being able to hunt with a bunch of allies who dont also have high surv- and now that old cheese methods are gone its not as simple to send an alt out to trap it somewhere while you kill it (new cheese strats are 100% soloable wow!)

whaling is also particularly stupid; what was originally looking like an exciting part of combat for big villages to go around stomping whales has become only possible to do solo and with cheese- ever since the combat change where riders of a boat can't attack (due to pvp implications)... how the hell is anyone supposed to fight them without a knarr for each individual fighter, of which groups can be as large as 10? the only way to kill them is by cheesing them, which all that requires is for rng to bless you with a whale slower than your boat

[shubla]

i think the surv hardcap can be removed without seriously harming the game;

Yeah, too often it happens that other villagers will just look from the side as the one guy with highest survival must do all the fighting.
Most if not all hunting related things are just devs poor attempts to prevent abuse, failing at it, and just causing great misery for all.