Allow us to reroll quests without abandoning

[vatas]

Credo Pass

[loleznub]

Everything else in the game is getting time-gated right now (farming-> wild crops, mining -> pyres, tree's -> farming -> wild crops) so why not just do the same thing for credo's?

Just remove questing to credos and make it a 96 hour long 'timer' for each pre-requisite credo and remove the questing/rng part entirely? Everyone is then on the same playing field and there's no RNG at all.

Want farmer? Gotta do Gatherer for 96h, then farmer for 96h + 96h.

This way there is no chance of you getting hard stuck with bad quest after bad quest (study talking whale 5x topkek) and it makes specializing (especially in the early game) more meaningful.

[Mr_Bober]

Everything else in the game is getting time-gated right now (farming-> wild crops, mining -> pyres, tree's -> farming -> wild crops) so why not just do the same thing for credo's?

Just remove questing to credos and make it a 96 hour long 'timer' for each pre-requisite credo and remove the questing/rng part entirely? Everyone is then on the same playing field and there's no RNG at all.

Want farmer? Gotta do Gatherer for 96h, then farmer for 96h + 96h.

This way there is no chance of you getting hard stuck with bad quest after bad quest (study talking whale 5x topkek) and it makes specializing (especially in the early game) more meaningful.

Slowing down credos is not a bad idea, but I wouldn't turn them into completely passive things.
The devs are clearly putting effort into slowing early game, and most Credos problem are related to the fact that people want to complete a whole credo in a day.

A possible way to do this would be the following:
- Each Credo would have a timer per each level, based on the amount of quests required.
- Each level would have a single goal that you need to complete.
- In order to progress to the next level, you must have completed the goal AND the timer has to run out.

For example, let's say you start with Forager. Level 1/5 could be 2 hours timer, with the goal of gathering 30 herbs.
After you gather the flowers, and 2 hours have passed since you started it, you get to Level 2/5. The timer increases and you get a new goal. For example 3 hours timer, gather 30 mushrooms and 20 flowers.
Keep in mind these examples are just random shit, I haven't really thought about proper timers and goals yet.

By keeping the goals more generic (eg. gather mushrooms instead of gather Bay Bolete), you avoid both the seasonal issue and greatly reduce how much luck matters.
Credos might have multiple goals the further you are in a credo. As per the example, 1 goal per level could work.
You could keep an abandon quest option, although I'd limit it to once per day (if not remove it completely).

While I know some player wouldn't like this, I do feel like this would fit the dev's goal to slow down early game, without making Credos luck based as they are now.

[Pills]

I think hard time gates are terrible game design personally.

But i'm definitely all for a hard redesign of some of the quest types like the rework mystic got. I'd still like to see a free reroll though, i'm getting real tired of nomad dicking me with shitty RNG. Feel like I can't get past 5/5 1/6 for around 5 irl days now.

[Reiber]

idealy, "tame mufflon" shouldnt be an skip quest,

Depends on what the player has available, sure it could be argued that this is one you could prepare better for, but the reality is I didn't have any animals close to being tamed at all because i've already tamed everything i needed this world to get started on that front. I have some in progress for this credo but at the time of getting 3 tame quests in a row, all of them were at 15 or 35% and i'm not prepared to wait 3 days to complete a quest. Time gates are boring, give me actualy stuff to do any day of the week over just waiting for something to happen.

That was just my example of a frustrating quest to justify the request for being able to reroll without being punished once per day.

You are absolutely right though that they need redesigning and chosen more carefully, but I doubt we'll see a large rework of the entire credo system any time soon so i'd rather see small wins where we can get them that just makes the experience better for everybody across the board.

hm i didnt get my point across then,
quests that take you 3 days, and an bit of investment can totally exist, in fact they should, doing an credo should take [b]some[b] time and effort.
the reason why they are autoskipp quests is that you could also get "plant an turnip, eat an turnip" 25 times in an row and finish the credo in 20 minutes, and you are already autoskipping multiple actually impossible quests,

everyone taking an week for farmer is ok, the disparity between doing 2 credos an day, and doing one in 2 weeks is insane.

[Pills]

everyone taking an week for farmer is ok, the disparity between doing 2 credos an day, and doing one in 2 weeks is insane.

Yeah that's fair, no I agree, although there are definitely some impossible quests that just need to be removed or redesigned across the different credos, you're on the money that the disparity between actual time requirement is the core problem, and I fully agree there.

The disparity is largely to blame with my problem with nomad's taming quests, apart from taming an animal just doesn't feel very "nomad-y" to me, it certainly feels bad when you're trying to progress through and you go from a 1 hour "travel to this tree", 5 minute "make a seer's bones", 16 hour "study seer's tealeaves" and then suddenly 4 day "Tame a wild horse" or one I got earlier today and instantly abandoned, a 108 hour "study hand impression x3".

The range in "achievability in time" is, as you said, completely insane.

[Delamore]

Give multiple quests at a time, having to study some 3 day curio isn't awful as a task but it's awful because that whole time you cannot really do anything actively towards your credo.
If there were multiple at once, I could be studying some long curio or waiting to tame an animal while also doing some other quest that requires me to be actively involved in it instead of waiting.
Needs some balance so you don't just clear out the easiest of the offered quests and skip the rest, but being able to do multiple at once would mean you almost always have one you can actively pursue instead of just a timer you're waiting out.
People already do this to some degree, by always studying long curios that your credo might ask for so they don't have to wait the whole timer.

[loleznub]

Honestly doing something along the Numen system wouldn't be bad either.

You get issued a quest that has three parts to it;

Each part is a unique quest you can do. The first one is the only one that gives progress, but the other two allow you to reroll it for 'free' by completing one of the other ones. Abandoning it makes you go back in progress.

Only downside is if you get two duplicate quests and the first you that progresses needs more, forcing you to complete the reroll

[Pills]

yeah idk, the more the game gives me dogshit quests to do the less patience I have with it. Logged in today and went from 5/5 3/6 down 5/5 1/6 because it gave me two shitty taming quests in a row.

yes, i could better prepare, but the game could just also not have stupid quests like that in the first place. Like in a previous post, the problem is time discrepency between quests.

[Reiber]

[quote="Pills" apart from taming an animal just doesn't feel very "nomad-y" to me, [quote]

yea, thats another problem, i would like it if quests and prerequisit creedos would in generally fit intoo their own gameplay niche, like the miner. and farming creedos do,

forager/fisher-quarrman-miner-cavehermit are just an nice credo chain that basically just wants you to do what you already would do,raising your stats for 2 days and then mine,

other credos chains are weird and have quests that dont fit intoo their purpose, but are required for an gamplay niche, wich makes you go out of your way to finish them before you can start doing what you wanted to do in the firstplace, or require an village that provides you with recources you cant gather yourself trivializing the credo itself

sadly i see the "tame an horse" connection to nomads, because its the main way of quick travel, it pulls carts, you are already an hunter, and the creedo specifically buffs horses, and mongols hurr durr.
but yea , its proppably just there because you need nomad for herder,