99% of PVP/permadeath woes are an onboarding issue

[Halbertz]

thingcreature that stalks thingwalls like the smoke from lost, forcefully KOes and hearths you if you're standing around thingwalls for too long

Bots will just switch to "eyeing" instead of staying right next to thing.

[Robben_DuMarsch]

thingcreature that stalks thingwalls like the smoke from lost, forcefully KOes and hearths you if you're standing around thingwalls for too long

Bots will just switch to "eyeing" instead of staying right next to thing.

I guess mist could obscure eye but that would just incentivize camping.
I guess so would unremovable thicket, but that would also make camping less productive.

Meh, can't immediately think of a solution that doesn't really incentivize camping.

I still like my idea about stopping clients from receiving data to render unless server confirms LOS, if that wouldn't be too taxing on the servers, though.
Eyes would need to be an exception to that rule, if we didn't want camping, however.

[IsThisRad]

If thingbotting is an issue that's major enough to deter prospective players, and I'm not convinced it is, then I think the only thing you could do is some kind of crime modifier that makes assault, batter, and murder more severe within a small radius of a thingwall. The other proposed solutions have workarounds or are mostly ineffective if someone is determined. I don't think a crime modifier would even matter that much, the kind of people who are most liable to be picked on aren't super familiar with scent/crime/spamming Nidbanes.

People hanging around roads lying in wait for less prepared travelers to rob was an actual issue IRL for a long time too. Some places haven't even patched it out yet, devs may believe it's an expected and acceptable behavior that naturally arises from the systems in place. I feel like there's other more foundational issues that are way more solvable anyway

[gravesmerch]

You didn't see or hear the animal because you stormed through a dense forest and were not careful enough.

player view is crazy short already, it was reduced long ago because muh pvp

aint no fun in walk 3 tiles and check mini-tiny-map for 2 pixel icon of an adder face

[linkfanpc]

player view is crazy short already, it was reduced long ago because muh pvp

???

[fulma]

Your mistake was assuming the devs care for the newplayer other than the newplayer being "content" for the 2 or 3 full boting big villages.

[MightySheep]

I'm not sure I rly subscribe to this notion u need elaborate onboarding

The novelty of this game is it just dumps u into wilderness with no real explanation and you have to figure out how to survive

Having some detailed tutorial wouldn't make that experience more fun to me wat would improve the vibes is some rly simple lore/context/cinematic like you've been exiled on island for prisoners or u fell off a ship and washed ashore on a mysterious new land or something

Spoonfeeding might be the meta but this an off meta game

[vatas]

I'm not sure I rly subscribe to this notion u need elaborate onboarding

The novelty of this game is it just dumps u into wilderness with no real explanation and you have to figure out how to survive

Having some detailed tutorial wouldn't make that experience more fun to me wat would improve the vibes is some rly simple lore/context/cinematic like you've been exiled on island for prisoners or u fell off a ship and washed ashore on a mysterious new land or something

Spoonfeeding might be the meta but this an off meta game

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/fuck_you,_I_got_mine

[Smoked-Brisket]

8 years ago this would have been a good game to push people to in terms of a hardcore full loot sleeper where you get to scratch that itch of surviving in a world that is tough but fair. Those times are over, this game has been hijacked, like many before, by a few nobodies that have the time to whine enough and bot enough to push a tough game into an obscure failure. It is sad, but it happens all the time. Now we are in the failure phase. You will continue to see posts about how "players just need to be warned" Check all the new player survival guides that have popped up in the last few years. Sadly they are just updates from previous guides. Notice how there are no real secrets revealed, there is no one UI that everyone uses. Instead there are several public and many rumored. When pushed, those that use secret UI's deflect by saying "this one devious guy made his secrets public." That was years ago. This is a compromised game and until they offer a pve server with new content noone should play it.

[IsThisRad]

... The novelty of this game is it just dumps u into wilderness with no real explanation and you have to figure out how to survive

Having some detailed tutorial wouldn't make that experience more fun to me wat would improve the vibes is some rly simple lore/context/cinematic like you've been exiled on island for prisoners or u fell off a ship and washed ashore on a mysterious new land or something ...

I agree that a detailed tutorial wouldn't fit this game and that the "joy of discovery" is charming a lot of the time. Things like inheritance having very little indication feels more like a design oversight or negligence than intentional vibe setting, though, and I would like to see them try to fix things like this instead of the back and forth band-aid fixes that don't feel like they're working. We should be seeing more influx of new and returning players now that the game is on Steam

... Notice how there are no real secrets revealed, there is no one UI that everyone uses. Instead there are several public and many rumored. When pushed, those that use secret UI's deflect by saying "this one devious guy made his secrets public." That was years ago. This is a compromised game and until they offer a pve server with new content noone should play it.

I mean yeah it's unfortunate that instead of obvious QOL and options being incorporated into main client you have to tell friends to download Ender from the workshop first, but that already gives pretty good UI improvement control. What "secrets" are you talking about? Min-maxers will develop a meta client for their buddies to use to squeeze every last bit of advantage, but it's not like someone who has practiced with PVP on these is suddenly going to be impotent at the game if they switch to Ender. You can still see hitboxes and hide trees and shit.

I only ever see vaguepost venting about client and botting shit, it's never pointing me to a specific busted advantage and I feel like 80% of the time (generous) it's hermits or groups of 2-5 complaining about either giant groups that have huge number advantages on them no matter what, or a smaller group of people that are just nolifing the game bigger fish style. Please feel free to show me what I'm missing here