Bots, lets talk about them.

[Amanda44]

I think the biggest reason people bot is that there is just too many unfun chores. Bots allow you to skip the tedious stuff. It is a game, and the main purpose of a game is to derive enjoyment. I don't think there is much hope in eliminating bots, but when it takes a couple hours unfun investment everyday to just feed and sort cattle, they are hard to avoid.

I agree with your reasoning for why they are mainly used but they are easy to avoid.

I do understand the reasoning behind bots be it to do the boring tasks, gain an advantage, show off your scripting expertise or a combination of all three, but personally I don't and have never used them.

If a game is truly that boring that I can't be bothered to actually play it then I'd rather just leave and play something I enjoy more than 'pretend' to play, it just seems pointless to me.
If it's to gain an advantage, well at least this I understand more, I quite like the advantages from running bots, lol and have at times in the past been tempted but, like V, I feel it is cheating and is unfair on those that play the game as intended. I'd much rather gain by my own hand and therefore also get the satisfaction that comes with it.
If I was an expert in scripting then maybe I would use games as a platform to show them off in, I can't answer that as I'm not, but I like to think that if the developers and the players were actively trying to reduce the use of bots then I'd take them some place else.

And that's my perspective on them.

As for prevention;

Whilst devs take the stance that making the game harder to bot and less desirable to bot, which ofc is a stance I agree with, is all they are prepared to do to prevent them, even to the point of making the game less 'fun' for the rest of us, I do also think, unlike Shrapnelx, that more should be done to penalise those that do use them, esp when devs are aware just how much of an advantage certain bots can give. There are lots of ppl and we have seen them here, who won't touch a game that has such rampant bot abuse that is 'seemingly' sanctioned with the devs. I'm not saying it's 100% effective, proxy accounts, etc, but I've seen a lot of other games actively seek out bots and their users and ban them from the game, a lot enlist other players help in spotting them too and I just think it has to be more effective than doing nothing, which in turn is more or less giving them a green light, and also makes it crystal clear to others interested in the game that botting is not sanctioned.

[LadyGoo]

I didnt read your post to be honest.
But grindy tasks like farming/etc. should indeed be changed totally.

To what?

I am not sure whether my suggestion were already told by someone else (didn't have time to read the whole thread). I'll try to explain how to counter the most popular botting types:

Farming bots:
Make the quality matter in terms of quantity, Jorb. Higher quality crops you have, more production you will get. Let's say you have a q100 beetroot. Therefore, you will obtain 9-12 beetroots, instead of default 3, if you have a druidic rite. This will:
- equalize somehow the bot owners and the protestants.
- you will spend 3 times less time on harvesting / or you will be 3 times more efficient
- introduce an autodrinker or reduce the stamina consumption
- auto-pile placer

Tree chopping bots:
- same, there is a need for an autodrinker.

Survey bots:
-autodrinker
-autopile placer

Miner bots:
- allow selecting the area to mine
- autodrinker
- autopile placer

Brick-making bots:
- autodrinker
- auto-pile placer


Summing up, if you will make it possible to autodrink without interrupting an action, you will resolve most of the botting inequity. Auto-pile placer is the second feature to be considered.

[Carebear]

I didnt read your post to be honest.
But grindy tasks like farming/etc. should indeed be changed totally.

To what?

I am not sure whether my suggestion were already told by someone else (didn't have time to read the whole thread). I'll try to explain how to counter the most popular botting types:

Farming bots:
Make the quality matter in terms of quantity, Jorb. Higher quality crops you have, more production you will get. Let's say you have a q100 beetroot. Therefore, you will obtain 9-12 beetroots, instead of default 3, if you have a druidic rite. This will:
- equalize somehow the bot owners and the protestants.
- you will spend 3 times less time on harvesting / or you will be 3 times more efficient
- introduce an autodrinker or reduce the stamina consumption
- auto-pile placer

Tree chopping bots:
- same, there is a need for an autodrinker.

Survey bots:
-autodrinker
-autopile placer

Miner bots:
- allow selecting the area to mine
- autodrinker
- autopile placer

Brick-making bots:
- autodrinker
- auto-pile placer


Summing up, if you will make it possible to autodrink without interrupting an action, you will resolve most of the botting inequity. Auto-pile placer is the second feature to be considered.

+1

and once it is in get the MODs to auto-delete any post that contains BOT related discussion and lets get back to the game.

[boshaw]

I make and use bots so I can play Hafen and Hearth: RTS edition

[Ethan]

I didnt read your post to be honest.
But grindy tasks like farming/etc. should indeed be changed totally.

To what?

I am not sure whether my suggestion were already told by someone else (didn't have time to read the whole thread). I'll try to explain how to counter the most popular botting types:

Farming bots:
Make the quality matter in terms of quantity, Jorb. Higher quality crops you have, more production you will get. Let's say you have a q100 beetroot. Therefore, you will obtain 9-12 beetroots, instead of

Interesting.

I think I would prefer it if instead of producing more crops from a single tile. That the crops harvested count for more. Q40 beetroot counts for 2 beetroot (fills 2x as many fodder units in a trough). Q40 barley produces 2x as much flour. could even use the Essence quality, since it currently has no use for food items.

[Avu]

Why would botters care if you get more beets? They also will get more beets from farming doh so they can feed even bigger cow farms...

And how does drinking without interuption stop botters or makes them want to bot less? All it does is make people with inventories full of water be able to run more than the ones that don't, like in "the good old days" no? And we don't want that. Or do you?

[LadyGoo]

Why would botters care if you get more beets? They also will get more beets from farming doh so they can feed even bigger cow farms...

And how does drinking without interuption stop botters or makes them want to bot less? All it does is make people with inventories full of water be able to run more than the ones that don't, like in "the good old days" no? And we don't want that. Or do you?

What stops botters from having even bigger farms now? The way how the devs have designed the game, so that there is no point in making excessive amounts of food (fep system) = no need for bigger numbers of cows.

The point of auto-drinking is to dissolve the inequity of time and effort. If you will be able to produce more crops, you will have more food. At some point you will not need that much food as well. So you will work towards the meaningful quality improvement, rather than mass production.
I can see the devs have already attempted to remove the botting problem with farming by allowing people to auto-select and harvest the crops and etc. The points I have suggested are the extension of that notion: design the game in a way that there will be less reasons to bot. What I have learned as a designer, if you do not like how people behave, change the context and the environment.

Also, how is auto-drinking is different to what we have now? People with more water in inventory can still escape.

[Avu]

Unless it got changed from way back when I tested it takes longer to drink than you gain by sprinting. And of course you got to stop...

Why not suggest massively lowering the stamina drain from farming instead.

And bigger cow farms means bigger alt factories if there ever will be any competition and those become needed again.

And still botters will ever be on top since they can get stuff done when you're not actually playing, while you sleep while you work while you watch a movie. There is no way to reduce this huge advantage just punish those that do it to instill enough fear in others to lessen the phenomenon but of course never fully. Until then best you can achieve is well it's not so bad I can still have fun but of course I can never compete with the ones that bot which works for now since you know there are not enough people that play or play serious enough for actual competition but if the game ever bounces back (which I'm not sure it can) it will need to make effort worth it. Alternatively the guys with the most autonomous bots win.

[Leksar]

If you can not put the time in to play the game then don't play. If you can not live with doing whats within your time then don't play. If you can not keep up without a bot then maybe you should seek out others to help you keep up. Using bots to gain an advantage is also wrong. You don't win by doing so you only cheat another.

this

[dafels]

Also, how is auto-drinking is different to what we have now? People with more water in inventory can still escape.

Agreed. Why did they remove that you can't move while drinking? What did this really fix or what was it supposed to fix? Everything is the same, drinking is just more of an annoyment now.