Feedback on the Food System

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Feedback on the Food System

Postby LadyGoo » Sat Feb 13, 2016 6:39 pm

This is going to be a bit massive. I might have missed something, but have pretty much covered what I have been facing personally.

Strength
- Food production and industry is one of the key elements of the game: you use the food to survive, gain stats needed for crafters and warriors, trade it to other people. Therefore, any village spends 50% of their time on food-related aspects (looking after cattle, farming, hunting, baking, cheese-making and etc.);
- Farming, cheese-making and hunting importance and meaning are well-balanced throughout the village evolution (hunting is important early-mid game, cheese-making for the mid-late game).

- The current FEP system encourages more thoughtful food consumption:
1. Quality over quantity. Pepper, as a FEP bonus booster, has increased its value (used widely in villages and sold on markets);
2. No more massive cheese-making like in Legacy (we have made 2 mansions of midnight blue cheese and could not finish them, whereas in Legacy it would be nothing, since people could consume that much in 1 day);
3. Therefore, the game is healthier in terms of time it requires to be spent to stay competitive. Moreover, minor villages have a chance to compete with bigger factions stat-wise;

- The higher quality symbel items do not boost FEP and hunger reduction massively, but still are relatively good to be crafted and used. Therefore, we do not have the unfair situation like in world 3, where factions like Sodom or AD could get 1 stat from 1 food, using their uber-tables, while the rest of the world would remain underdeveloped.

- Fishing is extremely important in the beginning of the world for 1-2 weeks;
- Berries foraging is very important in the beginning of the world as well;
- In the past, it was quite hard to gain strength without hunting or having a cheese production. Nowadays, people could make Steak&Tuber/Meatpies in order to gain str. This has created higher food production diversity and reduced the pressure to have higher numbers of livestock for cheese;
- Entrails are quite important in terms of food-making and producing additional intestines. Nothing goes to a waste after butchering an animal. Feels good and rewarding;
- Suckling maws have reduced the number of rennet and goldbeater's skin, making them more demanded and enhancing the trade;
- Mussel-collection is still important, despite of reduction of pearl drop rate;


Weaknesses:
- Most villages have a pre-set menu they produce in massive amounts, while the rest of the food types are not produced at all. Therefore, only 10 types of food are being produced, while the rest is being undermined.
A typical menu would be:
1. Boiled mussels (dex.+psy). This type of food has been used primarily for my crafter's dexterity and psy improvement. It is quite overpowered, and used as a FEP filler widely. Moreover, I have never cooked pirozhki, since they take too much effort, while I could eat 2-3 boiled mussels instead. Liver and Onions could be used alongside with them, but they are not that good.
2. Buttered Cave bulbs (psy). While Wonderful Wilderness Wurst gives a lot of psy, the effort for making it is too high. Therefore it is profitable to use mussels+cave bulbs combo to gain PSY. Moreover, I have been able to keep my character's stats at top PSY, needed for the craft of highest quality items;
3. Brodgar Blue Cheese (str). Gives pure strenght. Perfect for anyone who does not have 300-400 str yet. In the future world I can foresee that with 200 lvl caps, midnight blue cheese won't be produced at all;
4. Midnight Blue Cheese (str). The food, which is consumed by palibashers and peope with 500+ stats.
5. Big Bear Banger (str). Important for the early-game. Bear salami is not as popular, since it gives Charisma, most annoying and useless stat at the moment.
6. Boar Baloney sausage (str). Important for the early-game. Could be used as a nice FEP filler for miners.
7. Piglet Wursts (str)
8. Carrot cake (perception). Due to the problems with the production of rennet and shortage of sackling maws, it has replaced the mozarella cheese (gives a lot of charisma as well). Alongside with normal carrots, the carrot cake is the best food for improving your perception.
9. Delicious Deer Dogs (agi). One of the most desired sausages. Good even for the mid-game.
10. Brodgar Ring (agi). This is the best agi food in terms of reward/effort+time. Therefore, it has removed the craft of Creamy Camemberts;
11. Red-Shred Salad (const). The only salad I craft. Moreover, it is the only food for constitution I have been consuming.
12. Blueberry pie (int). Fish pies could be used as well, but they are not as good as blueberry pies + require too much work. So I have been crafting the blueberry pies massively for int. gain.
13. Jorbonzola (int). The third and the last cheese type we were producing.
14. Honeybuns (agi). Nice agility filler for DDD and Brodgar Rings.


Summing up (this is true for my allied villages):
- Only 3 types of cheese is worth producing. With the 200 stat caps, the number will decrease to 1.
- Only 4 types of sausages are worth to be crafted constantly in the mid-game. Therefore it makes bear, boar and deer the most desirable prey. We would drop badgers and foxes, if we would run out of space in out cart. Other types of sausages could be crafted if there is no other prey first 1-2 months of the game. Afterwards it is not worth of the effort.
- Fishing is important only in the early game. After the first month, everyone forgets about it. Moreover, the second fishing device, which requires leather, has not been used at all. The reason for that is that it was too expensive + people would prefer afk fishing.
- Only 4 types of baked goods are the best to be produced until the late game.
- Boiled mussels are a way too overpowered (you can hate me, people).


- We have been planting different types of berries for FEP filling. However, we have noticed, that it is more profitable to do so with carrots or even beets.

Therefore, more than 80% of the food introduced by devs are not being crafted at all. The most common reasons are:
1. Number of the ingridients. 3 is the maximum comfortable number of the ingridients for 1 food type, as I have noticed. If it goes beyond that, I will try to produce something less demanding and more profitable.
2. Most of the underused food has too much CHARISMA. Until the day charisma becomes a valuable stat, we will have this trend going.
3. The underused food is badly balanced in terms of ingredients availability, time for production and reward.



Following the tendency, described above, simbel items have the same problem: less than a half of the items, introduced by devs, are being used by large-mid villages.
The typical table a few months ago would look like that:
Image

- Silk napkin and tablecloth are too expensive and time-consuming;
- Silver cutlery gives less bonus than the metal cutlery (!!!); Therefore, it reduces the meaning of silver and trade-value.
- Сake knife is a trash in comparison what it used to give in Legacy. Low trade-value.



Opportunities

- Charisma could be re-considered as a stat and have more uses, like in Legacy. Bonfire party bonus was amazing: if people's combined charisma would create some food even bonus, it would encourage all-village feasts, role-playing and etc. There should be wider use for Charisma in general. As a result, people will start cooking food with higher charisma component;
- Alternatively, the chance of gaining charisma could be reduced, encouraging people to cook wider range of food;
- Some food could be re-evaluated in terms of effort against the reward, and be more balanced;
- Some symbel items could be boosted, so that there would be a wider range of table inventory crafted and traded + increasing the value of the materials being used;
- Boiled mussels could be nerfed, or there should be more dexterity food introduced;
- Cheese stat values should be re-considered, so it would not extinct as a food type;
- Introducing more food related to fishing could help the noobs both stat and trade-wise;
- Balancing sausages could make any type of prey desirable in mid-late game;
- Berries could have higher FEP-filling value, so there would be a point in having berry bushes plantations;
- Berries could be collected easier (into a bucket).

Threats
- With the stat caps, the diversity in cheese production will lose it's meaning. So, there will be only a few types of cheese produced;
- With the stat caps, on the other hand, the cheese production might increase its strategical meaning in terms of mass-spamming fighting alts;
- Fishing will remain as a part of the early game, nothing more;
- Knowing the experience from the past world, people won't bother with planting the berry bushes for the fep-filling purposes.

And other stuff I will add later, if they will cross my mind.
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Re: Feedback on the Food System

Postby Avu » Sat Feb 13, 2016 6:48 pm

I will have to agree.
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Re: Feedback on the Food System

Postby APXEOLOG » Sat Feb 13, 2016 7:20 pm

LadyGoo wrote:- Cheese stat values should be re-considered, so it would not extinct as a food type;

I think it would be better to just increase production count. If people will have 4 times more cheese after slicing then now, i bet it will be enough to let cheesemaking be alive.
More cheese output -> less cheese production (because hunger is constant and people cannot eat food endlessly without fep debuff) -> less milk requirments -> less cows -> less farming. All this stages consumes a lot of time (and this chain of actions is perfect target for botting)
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Re: Feedback on the Food System

Postby DDDsDD999 » Sat Feb 13, 2016 7:23 pm

Signed
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Re: Feedback on the Food System

Postby sabinati » Sat Feb 13, 2016 7:49 pm

i disagree on a couple minor points,

silk tablecloth, seems pretty decent, mine is 75% hunger reduction

Image

lamb sausage is pretty good per source. chicken chorizo is good per/dex. linseed loaf is a per/con food worth making. cavedog is a good one to mix in for per/psy. creamy cock is really good, i was still getting 1 stat per food with them at 200+ stats. apple pie is the best con food, but i ate lots of cow chorizo, just from culling the cattle herd. butter scones are a pretty good dex food.

badger and fox are good early-mid sources for agi, con, and int
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Re: Feedback on the Food System

Postby Pickard » Sat Feb 13, 2016 8:23 pm

sabinati wrote:silk tablecloth, seems pretty decent, mine is 75% hunger reduction

Silk tablecloth is good, but has cheap alternatives
Image
This table is slightly higher quality but ~20% wear.
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Re: Feedback on the Food System

Postby evilboy666 » Sat Feb 13, 2016 8:30 pm

Are boiled mussels op or you bot the shit out of them?
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Re: Feedback on the Food System

Postby razfen » Sat Feb 13, 2016 8:33 pm

evilboy666 wrote:Botting for fate curios
MagicManICT wrote:Not really any purpose of this thread other than to get a simple answer that some of you special children don't seem to know how to give. Everyone's got to be a fukkin comedian....
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Re: Feedback on the Food System

Postby Pickard » Sat Feb 13, 2016 8:36 pm

evilboy666 wrote:Are boiled mussels op or you bot the shit out of them?

Creamy cocks op
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Re: Feedback on the Food System

Postby evilboy666 » Sun Feb 14, 2016 9:32 am

razfen wrote:
evilboy666 wrote:Botting for fate curios


lol what what is your intention i don't even remember saying this.
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