Get rid of Visitor Debuff

[Ozzy123]

Well honestly removing visitor wouldn't fix safe palisades, people could just run in and close gates behind them, noone would try to run in and get locked anyways. I hope someone comes up with a way to get rid of the safe palisades as they are probably the worst thing that has happend to this game, literally 99% of the fights end up with one side running to a 10x10 palisade with 4 gates.

[Nek]

Also, I just wanna say this.
Visitor debuff has saved my ass a good number of times too. I'm not just saying it should be gone because somebody got away from me and I'm still seething over it, regardless of what you might think. During this world alone I've had numerous close calls in which visitor debuff has stopped me from dying, but that doesn't mean I think it's any less cheap.
I literally have a video of me going out to help a friend who said he was getting attacked like 20 seconds away from our village, I arrived too late just as he died, got chased myself by like 3 people (It was either AD or Ozzy and his crew, can't remember which), I take 3 decently large hits, I'm on like single digit health and then I run through the gate, didn't even shut it because fuck that and they had to give up their chase just like that. That shit is fucking homosex as fuck, doesn't matter if it saved my ass or not. It's L I T E R A L L Y a line that the enemy cannot cross for stupid as fuck reasons. We have gates in the game, gates can be played around, you can panic and misclick to open/close a gate, there is user error involved, there is miscommunication involved if you have others with you, visitor debuff cannot be played around.

Well honestly removing visitor wouldn't fix safe palisades, people could just run in and close gates behind them, noone would try to run in and get locked anyways. I hope someone comes up with a way to get rid of the safe palisades as they are probably the worst thing that has happend to this game, literally 99% of the fights end up with one side running to a 10x10 palisade with 4 gates.

No I do agree that most of the time one guy isn't gonna risk getting caught inside the palisade locked in with the enemy, but again that choice would still be an option. Also from my experience with gate dancing PvP (literally the worst PvP in the game and sadly some of the most prominent) is people can panic, everyone tries to rush into a gate without thinking, people are getting stuck clipping against people. If the enemy managed to kill enough people in that situation they could theoretically risk a bullrush in on the last remaining people but not while visitor debuff is a thing, that shit stops it dead.

Long term maybe something else could be done about those safe proxy palisades, but in the short term visitor debuff isn't doing anything to help the situation, it's only making it worse.

[Jackwolf]

Yes I said it myself and the only thing about visitor debuff I would want to see is that when two parties clash, where both used offensive card from deck, visitor debuff not working for both in term of character protection and still can aggro the same people who were involved in combat. Or generally engaging anyone who's redhanded or outlaw. To eliminate small stupid camps but visitor or not, You can't eliminate claims and locked doors.

I think this is a reasonable enough middle ground; at the very least it should remove the character protection but not completely remove visitor debuff. They steal wouldn't be able to steal, take the body, or loot the corpse, but they can certainly beat you down.

Alternative suggestion would be adding new types of gates; merchant or visitor or what have you. These cost more materials than regular gates, as well as dreams (or other hearth magic esque items, to give a reason why neener-neener can't do anything past this line)

[Nek]

Alternative suggestion would be adding new types of gates; merchant or visitor or what have you. These cost more materials than regular gates, as well as dreams (or other hearth magic esque items, to give a reason why neener-neener can't do anything past this line)

I'd prefer this option over the other, providing the gate actually cost a significant amount of materials so that
A. People couldn't just substitute every regular gate for one of these
and
B. People couldn't just use them to make proxy pali's without significant investment, maybe put some other restriction on it like 'needs to be on a village claim to set these types of gates'


Then make regular gates have no such debuff. If you go through a regular gate you can do whatever the fuck you like as per usual.
This is a solid compromise, trade hubs could still be a thing (they literally would have been a thing anyway even without visitor debuff but whatever) and would be just as safe as they are today, regular gates would no longer be a straight up no no zone to cross. I'd personally be happy as fuck with that change. Also as minor as it is, I like the inclusion of having some magic item be incorporated to justify the whole 'you can't get up to any funny business if you pass this shit' thing.

I might edit this in to my OP actually, I think it is a good balance of safety while not being overly handholdy as the current system is.

[Jackwolf]

A side note that most hermits or small villages would really only need to make one of such 'visitor gate' on their outer most sector to still be provided the same benefits as you have now, but it will require more investment obviously. Possibly even something higher up in the skill trees. This way the visitor debuff is something that's earned, rather than simply given.

Edit; further side note i have 0 idea what skill it could be tied to. There's nothing between Hearth magic and Druidic rite that would fit, and druidic rite is wayyyyyyyyy too far up the skill tree for it to be a reasonable requirement.

[maze]

the sole reason we have the buff is because~ some people in this fucking community can't stop from sneaking into enemy faction bases and inside raiding them.

the buff stops the enemys from just rolling in and smacking down a full town overnight because of an insider with a slave key.
or maybe you afk in your faction town. insider/spy opens gate lets in full team of shit who then kill you while you're afk.

So sure buff is shit because of the now pvp meta (btw there is a button to stop you from going over gate lines)
But without it insider become fking annoying again.

the only fix I would say should maybe become a thing. is give kingdoms the power to not get visitor debuff from towns/doors inside their own kingdom. that way they can police their area better or be ass hats.

[wonder-ass]

ehh im not so sure about the removal of visitor debuff it made it so things like public markets were a possibility and id rather have that stay a thing with the side effect of people being able to use it for pvp to run away.

[DDDsDD999]

I think the scenarios it does anything are pretty uncommon, since you can just close the gate if you know what you're doing. It also helps nabs who don't know how to do keys and lets public markets be a thing. It also lets us not have to use key alts for everything, instead gates are tied to claim permissions, which is pretty nice. I don't think its removal would really accomplish much.

[zebratul]

Visitor's has to stay for reasons already mentioned.
Jorb promised easier sieges, and eviction now takes 30 seconds — just dont get locked in the enemy's base and you're fine. If you have superior stats, you can even knock out and loot the sprucecap before you get knocked yourself.

[Granger]

so no more trade cities

Already debunked.

Link please - or it didn't happen.

I agree with removing visitor from stick branch fence gates, that at least would disable instant-secure caves 8h10s after being able to deploy a claim.