make targeting client side

Thoughts on the further development of Haven & Hearth? Feel free to opine!

make targeting client side

Postby SnuggleSnail » Wed Mar 31, 2021 3:28 pm

would be COOL if the time it takes to switch targets and perform an action was equal to your ping instead of a multiplier of it
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Re: make targeting client side

Postby Naimad » Wed Mar 31, 2021 5:34 pm

SnuggleSnail wrote:would be COOL if the time it takes to switch targets and perform an action was equal to your ping instead of a multiplier of it

it would be nice if your bots had a ping x100
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Re: make targeting client side

Postby Sevenless » Wed Mar 31, 2021 6:01 pm

I'm not 100% up on it, pvp isn't my forte, but aren't there interactions that are tied to who's targetting what? Like IP being given out to people targetting you when you use watch it's moves?

Desyncs sound like they'd cause problems with the combat system if so.
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Re: make targeting client side

Postby SnuggleSnail » Wed Mar 31, 2021 6:42 pm

Naimad wrote:
SnuggleSnail wrote:would be COOL if the time it takes to switch targets and perform an action was equal to your ping instead of a multiplier of it

it would be nice if your bots had a ping x100


If it was for bots I could literally rent a server in the same data center haven is hosted, maybe even the same rack if I'm lucky. Honestly, now I say that out loud, it might be way better to do that for regular play

Sevenless wrote:I'm not 100% up on it, pvp isn't my forte, but aren't there interactions that are tied to who's targetting what? Like IP being given out to people targetting you when you use watch it's moves?

Desyncs sound like they'd cause problems with the combat system if so.


I'm confident in loftar's ability to determine who's in combat with who while letting me send a packet requesting to smacc some nerd that isn't a target decided by the server.


It's seems silly to force an extra round trip for somebody to change target, and afaik not something anybody else does. The targeting could be client side, and the request the client sends to the server could just be rejected if it doesn't like what's up.


It shouldn't take somebody with 400 ms .4 seconds to change target >> human reaction time to queue a move because they need to verify they actually changed target or it will be queued on the wrong person > .2 seconds for that action to go throguh >> .2 seconds for that to show up on their screen. This could literally be more than halved
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Re: make targeting client side

Postby Ardennesss » Wed Mar 31, 2021 6:54 pm

SnuggleSnail wrote:
Naimad wrote:
SnuggleSnail wrote:would be COOL if the time it takes to switch targets and perform an action was equal to your ping instead of a multiplier of it

it would be nice if your bots had a ping x100


If it was for bots I could literally rent a server in the same data center haven is hosted, maybe even the same rack if I'm lucky. Honestly, now I say that out loud, it might be way better to do that for regular play

Sevenless wrote:I'm not 100% up on it, pvp isn't my forte, but aren't there interactions that are tied to who's targetting what? Like IP being given out to people targetting you when you use watch it's moves?

Desyncs sound like they'd cause problems with the combat system if so.


I'm confident in loftar's ability to determine who's in combat with who while letting me send a packet requesting to smacc some nerd that isn't a target decided by the server.


It's seems silly to force an extra round trip for somebody to change target, and afaik not something anybody else does. The targeting could be client side, and the request the client sends to the server could just be rejected if it doesn't like what's up.


It shouldn't take somebody with 400 ms .4 seconds to change target >> human reaction time to queue a move because they need to verify they actually changed target or it will be queued on the wrong person > .2 seconds for that action to go throguh >> .2 seconds for that to show up on their screen. This could literally be more than halved
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Re: make targeting client side

Postby Nightdawg » Wed Mar 31, 2021 7:21 pm

Why is targeting server sided?
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Re: make targeting client side

Postby kirillius98 » Wed Mar 31, 2021 7:27 pm

+1 for this, because it is weird to wait so long before being able to change your attack target
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Re: make targeting client side

Postby Sevenless » Wed Mar 31, 2021 9:25 pm

Nightdawg wrote:Why is targeting server sided?


Anytime an aiming mechanic is important to combat, leaving it on the client side makes it ripe for potential abuse by clients getting hacked. In haven's case, we this isn't even hacking because it's explicitly allowed. I'm not sure how useful it would be, but bots swapping combat targets to farm IP from people using defenses is a possibility. Server side targetted errs on the side of the fastest connection if the aiming mechanic is important. This is important because if you give advantage to the biggest ping (example client side hit detection in an FPS allows you to kill someone after the server already considers you dead, etc), that can be spoofed for advantage.

If the few mechanics that are related to targetting got fixed it would be fine though.
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Re: make targeting client side

Postby SnuggleSnail » Wed Mar 31, 2021 10:18 pm

I notice you don't know what you're talking about at all. Weird that you have a strong opinion with that being the case
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Re: make targeting client side

Postby Nightdawg » Wed Mar 31, 2021 10:26 pm

Sevenless wrote:
Nightdawg wrote:Why is targeting server sided?


Anytime an aiming mechanic is important to combat, leaving it on the client side makes it ripe for potential abuse by clients getting hacked. In haven's case, we this isn't even hacking because it's explicitly allowed. I'm not sure how useful it would be, but bots swapping combat targets to farm IP from people using defenses is a possibility. Server side targetted errs on the side of the fastest connection if the aiming mechanic is important. This is important because if you give advantage to the biggest ping (example client side hit detection in an FPS allows you to kill someone after the server already considers you dead, etc), that can be spoofed for advantage.

If the few mechanics that are related to targetting got fixed it would be fine though.


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You get coins even if you're not targetting the guy, as long as you're in combat with him.

You should be allowed to swap between targets without the server reading that, it should only read what attacks/restorations you triggered, and in the case of attacks, against whom you triggered them.

Unless I misunderstood what you meant.
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