Realm tributary system.

Thoughts on the further development of Haven & Hearth? Feel free to opine!

Re: Realm tributary system.

Postby mulamishne » Wed Aug 04, 2021 5:29 am

Haha, another thread about a realm change that has already been suggested, already shot down, and already wasting my brain cells trying to understand why you would think this is an idea that could ever function.

Same awful idea, different shitposter.
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Re: Realm tributary system.

Postby Dakkan » Wed Aug 04, 2021 5:41 am

Post count is useless to establish credentials, and you should never trust or believe anyone based on that alone.


Exhibit A: Image (A well known fumbler)

But disputing functional realm mechanics with Snail is just delightful, please continue. Honestly, I really wish SnuggleSnail would just start their own realm for once to see how hard it is, and maybe gain some perspective.

As for role-play mechanics, I think Boogis The Great had pretty much the same ideas, or someone-or-other in the past suggesting the exact same realm shit. We really need a whole subforum for realm suggestions. Forcing this sort of role-play mechanic is against what the devs had in mind in the past though. They want it to occur naturally, like W10 had.

Also whomever is using my name to kill hermits in game, please continue.
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Re: Realm tributary system.

Postby SavageFox » Wed Aug 04, 2021 1:17 pm

Regnurr wrote:
SnuggleSnail wrote:r u pranking me rn


No, you're genuinely like this.

Stop resorting to ad hominem fallacies against me, especially when I know you're wrong and you get made to look like a fool by someone who is an apparent newbie.



I agree with snail you're a complete dumbass :mrgreen: when it comes to this matter
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Re: Realm tributary system.

Postby cherryquartz » Wed Aug 04, 2021 1:51 pm

Regnurr wrote:Ever wanted to have a realm take a more pro-active approach to policing inside its borders? Add a realm tributary system, people with claims within the realm have an actual tax to pay, this could be placed in a special coffer for collection which confirms the claim's placement. Realm owners might have an interface that shows which claims have paid and who hasn't. This system should also come with a protection 'guarantee' depending on the character of the ruler, for example:

You as a citizen pay taxes and in return a significant portion of that budget is spent on the public services of the police, and in greater danger, the military (irl, it's questionable how much you should be spending here and other politics but :D).

These people are expected to enforce the order of their realm, and claims should have a warning system that tells the realm owner that they have obtained scents or a criminal act transpired to investigate. To make it easier, let's just say it magicked its way or got to them by carrier pidgeon, either way, this gives people a sense of security if the realm owner can protect the realm for real.

This could be addressed ingame by players themselves managing this kinda thing but a more official, secure, and automated system for taxes seems ideal.



Are you shublas alt? I thought only he was this fucking retarded. You've had an account for like 5 minutes and all you've done is bitch about the game, honestly, go and play something else if you hate haven so much. Your ideas are crap.
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Re: Realm tributary system.

Postby Regnurr » Wed Aug 04, 2021 7:47 pm

SavageFox wrote:
Regnurr wrote:
SnuggleSnail wrote:r u pranking me rn


No, you're genuinely like this.

Stop resorting to ad hominem fallacies against me, especially when I know you're wrong and you get made to look like a fool by someone who is an apparent newbie.



I agree with snail you're a complete dumbass :mrgreen: when it comes to this matter


Explain beyond name calling and challenge yourself to think for a bit.

cherryquartz wrote:
Regnurr wrote:Are you shublas alt? I thought only he was this fucking retarded. You've had an account for like 5 minutes and all you've done is bitch about the game, honestly, go and play something else if you hate haven so much. Your ideas are crap.


"Weh someone has only said negative things about a game they're obviously enjoying enough to play". Typical fanboyism approach, love it. Consistently happens if you don't lather praise on any game forum related to the actual game. This is the critique and ideas forum, it was made for this, don't like it? Take it up with Jorb.

Dakkan wrote:Post count is useless to establish credentials, and you should never trust or believe anyone based on that alone.


Exhibit A: Image (A well known fumbler)

But disputing functional realm mechanics with Snail is just delightful, please continue. Honestly, I really wish SnuggleSnail would just start their own realm for once to see how hard it is, and maybe gain some perspective.

As for role-play mechanics, I think Boogis The Great had pretty much the same ideas, or someone-or-other in the past suggesting the exact same realm shit. We really need a whole subforum for realm suggestions. Forcing this sort of role-play mechanic is against what the devs had in mind in the past though. They want it to occur naturally, like W10 had.

Also whomever is using my name to kill hermits in game, please continue.


Don't know them, though I'd like for this kind of thing to occur naturally, it tends not to do so. The easier it is to co-ordinate realm information and manage it using an actual interface, the more likely someone is to actually care. As it happens there isn't any in-built management utilities that really help you out and would need third party clients for book keeping.

I can sympathize with wanting these things to happen naturally though, because it would look quite good from an ant farm owner perspective.

The interesting part for me is, this suggestion wasn't even intended to make people's life easier if they live in a realm, because it does not mean that realm owners will honour their protection racket deal and may just be extorting the villages within their realm for goods and no service, hence me calling it a 'tributary' system and not a military. Ideally though, from the villager's perspective or the many chiefs, co-operation and mutual protection is a great idea, because the best solution to being out statted by people is to just outnumber them, swarm tactics keep big groups alive.
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Re: Realm tributary system.

Postby mulamishne » Wed Aug 04, 2021 7:58 pm

Regnurr wrote: The easier it is to co-ordinate realm information and manage it using an actual interface, the more likely someone is to actually care. As it happens there isn't any in-built management utilities that really help you out and would need third party clients for book keeping.

Just curious, have you ever actually interacted with the realm system? The 'tax' system was authority, the logic was that you wont kill your own subjects or let them die because they generate authority. Any items a random village will be able to produce will hardly be relevant to the groups taxing them, I have no idea what I'd want other than... roots? I guess?
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Re: Realm tributary system.

Postby cherryquartz » Wed Aug 04, 2021 9:09 pm

Regnurr wrote:"Weh someone has only said negative things about a game they're obviously enjoying enough to play". Typical fanboyism approach, love it. Consistently happens if you don't lather praise on any game forum related to the actual game. This is the critique and ideas forum, it was made for this, don't like it? Take it up with Jorb.



Did you just assume my gender?

I'm not expecting you to lather praise but before you come out with all these crappy mechanic changes that you have no idea about, try playing the game for longer than 5 minutes. I'm taking it up with you, since yours are the crappy ideas.
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Re: Realm tributary system.

Postby Regnurr » Wed Aug 04, 2021 10:08 pm

mulamishne wrote:
Regnurr wrote: The easier it is to co-ordinate realm information and manage it using an actual interface, the more likely someone is to actually care. As it happens there isn't any in-built management utilities that really help you out and would need third party clients for book keeping.

Just curious, have you ever actually interacted with the realm system? The 'tax' system was authority, the logic was that you wont kill your own subjects or let them die because they generate authority. Any items a random village will be able to produce will hardly be relevant to the groups taxing them, I have no idea what I'd want other than... roots? I guess?


LP.
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Re: Realm tributary system.

Postby mulamishne » Thu Aug 05, 2021 12:10 am

Regnurr wrote:
mulamishne wrote:
Regnurr wrote: The easier it is to co-ordinate realm information and manage it using an actual interface, the more likely someone is to actually care. As it happens there isn't any in-built management utilities that really help you out and would need third party clients for book keeping.

Just curious, have you ever actually interacted with the realm system? The 'tax' system was authority, the logic was that you wont kill your own subjects or let them die because they generate authority. Any items a random village will be able to produce will hardly be relevant to the groups taxing them, I have no idea what I'd want other than... roots? I guess?


LP.


Do you mean hard LP? Just a % of what they're earning? Or Curios?

If it's hard LP, you can just use xp (which is already earned in the current system with 'From the Coffers!') to meditate a curio and gain functional LP. If it's curios, why would I want random curio income when my village can produce better?

Anything to buff realms like this is kinda bad because it makes a realm more needed for competitive play.
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Re: Realm tributary system.

Postby Regnurr » Thu Aug 05, 2021 3:15 am

mulamishne wrote:Do you mean hard LP? Just a % of what they're earning? Or Curios?

If it's hard LP, you can just use xp (which is already earned in the current system with 'From the Coffers!') to meditate a curio and gain functional LP. If it's curios, why would I want random curio income when my village can produce better?

Anything to buff realms like this is kinda bad because it makes a realm more needed for competitive play.


Just straight up LP on top of what you could get out of study. I don't mind realms being necessary to get better stuff though, because that again is more realistic. Hermits just can't compete with cities, that's life.
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