Farm animals need improvement

[Barbamaus]

Farm animals are a source of hides, entrails, intestines, meat, bones, as well as milk and wool (some of them). But most of the stuff you get from them is close to useless.

Domesticating animals should be the equivalent of gardening herbs. Let me explain.
Early game you go foraging to gather herbs and mushrooms. If you develop your gardening industry properly, you never have to go forage for those specific herbs and mushrooms ever again. Not only you can produce large quantities of it, but they easily and quickly raise in quality, making it a way better source than foraging. This doesn't make foraging useless, since there's stuff you can't garden, but it does reduce the need for it.

Taming wild animals should have the same effect on hunting.
Farm animals should be a good source of animal parts, replacing the need for "bulk hunting". Hunters would only need to go hunt for specific animals (for crafting specific items), or for bigger prey like marine animals, cave dwellers, or mammoths.
Unfortunately, right now this is impossible.
Animals are a necessity due to wool and milk, but other than that they are close to useless. Their meats (except pork) are among the least used in good recipes. Even after months the quality of their parts will still be lower than the average hunted animal, making it worthless for crafting and not even good enough for quality mulch. And their hides have no special use.

To improve them I think there's 3 main factors:
1st. There need to be good crafting recipes, like equipment/gildings but also food or other items, made with domesticated animal hides to make them relevant. They shouldn't replace ALL other equipments, but at least a few.
2nd. Their generic parts need to be good for something. This either means making them grow in quality faster (and/or more consistently), or make their parts count "more" for specific things (eg. domesticated animal parts could count as twice their quality for mulch production). Because even if we had a great bull cape, you won't be crafting hundreds of them.
3rd. When tamed, their quality shouldn't drop down to 10. This would keep taming relevant for longer, as hunters could bring back new animals from quality spots. The new quality doesn't need to be 1:1, but taming a higher quality wild animal should provide a good quality domesticated one.

We begin as naked beings in the woods, relying on wild stuff to survive. We build villages, with mineholes and wells, to take control of resources and improve the quality of what's available in the wild. We need to be able to do the same with the animals, making hunting something you mostly leave behind as you progress.

[tadeo]

Based

I adressing the same problem but more specific for farm animals meats in :
viewtopic.php?f=48&t=75493

[Dawidio123]

Tamed meat got fucked this world tbh, beef and pork were pretty good last world.
I think overall A LOT of recipes need to be buffed or adjusted at least.

[Harunobu]

I don't get why when you take an animal, it doesn't start out as the quality of the wild animal. It resets back to 10.

[azrid]

tamed animals are in a good balanced spot right now

[Barbamaus]

tamed animals are in a good balanced spot right now

How so?
Their hides, entrails, and bones are trash compared to anything you can hunt.

It would make sense, since we do it with other industries, to have tamed animal become the main way to improve the quality of glue (and other bone stuff) and leather.

[azrid]

tamed animals are in a good balanced spot right now

How so?
Their hides, entrails, and bones are trash compared to anything you can hunt.

It would make sense, since we do it with other industries, to have tamed animal become the main way to improve the quality of glue (and other bone stuff) and leather.

they have the potential to be better quality than wild animals
you keep animals if you want cheese
it would not make sense to have everything you need contained in your village
you want people to go roam the lands or it will feel like a dead game with 0 encounters of others

[Barbamaus]

tamed animals are in a good balanced spot right now

How so?
Their hides, entrails, and bones are trash compared to anything you can hunt.

It would make sense, since we do it with other industries, to have tamed animal become the main way to improve the quality of glue (and other bone stuff) and leather.

they have the potential to be better quality than wild animals

After how long? It's the only industry that only becomes decent when the game is already dead. They should grow in quality at the same pace as trees at least, then they'd be a bit more useful.

it would not make sense to have everything you need contained in your village
you want people to go roam the lands or it will feel like a dead game with 0 encounters of others

It would make perfect sense, since every other industry allows it. Gardening is the prefect example of making inside what you'd normally go outside to get. Heck even forestry is done inside a palisade, so why can't we make good leather and glue with cows and horses?

As for the world feeling dead, not sure where you settled, but even though my area still has active villages, realms, and it's not a secluded island or other remote land, it still feels dead. People don't roam around: they use thingwalls, charter stones, and trails specifically to avoid interacting with random players while outside. Very few people, mostly newbies that don't know any better or people looking for a fight, don't run the other way if they see a player on their screen.

[Sevenless]

Paraphrasing math I did in the past: farmed animals take 10-11 months to become better than all natural sources of meat/bones. That's before we talk about the questing mechanics that allowed us to have 1000q seals last world, which will basically keep up with farm animals within the timeframe of a world since worlds tend to last 12-16 months. And meaningful breeding doesn't get rolling for 2-4 weeks anyway. The game is "over" for most of the population by month three.

Overall, one thing I'd like to see is just increasing the quality and breeding quality gain by +5. Instead of Q being -5 to +20, just make it 0 to +25. Very mild buff, but I think it'd be satisfying for the average player to always get improvement without getting into the messy details of it. Making the % gains go from 0>+10 would be the more meaningful one though, especially for people breeding hybridizing herds (which is almost no one as far as I'm aware, too much hassle for the benefit). Overall, making quality gain from animals overkilled still wouldn't be the end of the world, because Q1000 seals were still Q600 or something due to tools hard capping.

And as for the meat, just make the unique recipes that come from them good powerfoods (accounting for the meat's low base quality, and needing to tie it to the quality spiral of frying pans or ovens to keep it relevant in later world). Preferably recipes that aren't annoying as heck like shepherd's pie.

If you actually wanted to make animals truely relevant in the quality grind, do the above quality changes and add in manure as a soil mechanic for tree quality. If the quality gain on animals is properly tuned, when other sources of quality start to slow down for deep worlders (I will profess I'm naive as to when this would be best to arrive, and what qualities things like troll/whale mulch end up being for factions), animal manure could introduce a soure of permanent long term spiral that pushes everything else up.


I think it's important to consider dev time in suggestions. We know they're busy irl, so changes like this that are working within the existing mechanics are easier I think?

[stya]

Paraphrasing math I did in the past: farmed animals take 10-11 months to become better than all natural sources of meat/bones. That's before we talk about the questing mechanics that allowed us to have 1000q seals last world, which will basically keep up with farm animals within the timeframe of a world since worlds tend to last 12-16 months. And meaningful breeding doesn't get rolling for 2-4 weeks anyway. The game is "over" for most of the population by month three.

Overall, one thing I'd like to see is just increasing the quality and breeding quality gain by +5. Instead of Q being -5 to +20, just make it 0 to +25. Very mild buff, but I think it'd be satisfying for the average player to always get improvement without getting into the messy details of it. Making the % gains go from 0>+10 would be the more meaningful one though, especially for people breeding hybridizing herds (which is almost no one as far as I'm aware, too much hassle for the benefit). Overall, making quality gain from animals overkilled still wouldn't be the end of the world, because Q1000 seals were still Q600 or something due to tools hard capping.

And as for the meat, just make the unique recipes that come from them good powerfoods (accounting for the meat's low base quality, and needing to tie it to the quality spiral of frying pans or ovens to keep it relevant in later world). Preferably recipes that aren't annoying as heck like shepherd's pie.

If you actually wanted to make animals truely relevant in the quality grind, do the above quality changes and add in manure as a soil mechanic for tree quality. If the quality gain on animals is properly tuned, when other sources of quality start to slow down for deep worlders (I will profess I'm naive as to when this would be best to arrive, and what qualities things like troll/whale mulch end up being for factions), animal manure could introduce a soure of permanent long term spiral that pushes everything else up.


I think it's important to consider dev time in suggestions. We know they're busy irl, so changes like this that are working within the existing mechanics are easier I think?

q1000 seals should really not be a thing, questing is as a whole was always broken to some degree, between being an OP source of lp early world, free hunger resets at some point, insane XP source and a super q booster...

Hopefully the devs will just nuke it completely one day or nerf it to the ground.

Farmed meat recipes got mostly nerfed to shit, except some very few, very oriented ones (pork balls says hello)... Cheese doesn't even need really good cattle management to be impactful.

I also think like Sevenless -5 to +20 is a big bad thing because RNG sucks, 0 to +20 or +5 to +15 would make cattle a lot less bad, removing % stats would simplify everything (how many headaches caused to confused sprucecaps?) and let's remove hybrids because this is fucked up and too much?