Winter event

[Crest]

So, what is it that gets said about winter? Nobody likes it, everybody hates it, nobody wants to go out in winter because it's dangerous and hard to escape ganks and group fights never really happen?
How about this. Instead of fixing any of that shit (which they haven't done anyway), we simply implement a worldwide event that happens (similar to the meteor event) during winter to incentivize everybody to not only be on and active during winter but to go out to a certain location as a group with the expectation that other groups will be doing the same.

I for one think it would be hilarious seeing what sort of clusterfuck group fighting would occur with everybody on sleighs and skis. Imagine the numbers you see at meteor events... only now it's much more dangerous and chaotic because of the existence of skis, sleds and sleighs.
Like it or not, they exist. Winter exists. So do something with it or delete it entirely.

[SnuggleSnail]

Literally nobody would go. There have been plenty of meteors during winter, and nobody goes. The last fight to happen during winter was in early 2020, and calling it an actual fight feels feels generous. One side just left on knarrs in less than 5 minutes. Winter has also gotten drastically worse for PVP since then.

Feedback for games tends to be a bit hyperbolic, so I can kindof understand if a third party thinks I'm doing an exaggerated cringe gamerrage by saying this, but winter is pretty much unplayable for PVP.

[Detharon]

I for one think it would be hilarious seeing what sort of clusterfuck group fighting would occur with everybody on sleighs and skis. Imagine the numbers you see at meteor events... only now it's much more dangerous and chaotic because of the existence of skis, sleds and sleighs.

I can tell you how a sleigh fight looks like.

You have one and so does your enemy. You both move with equal speed so you'll never catch anyone, but you can't really escape either.

You can try killing your opponent's reindeer, but unless he's blind and deaf this is not going to happen. You can literally chase each other for hours, or until someone escapes to a ship / safepali, or falls asleep irl.

It was bad before, but sleighs somehow managed to make it worse.

Long time ago, before the skis were introduced, people only used sleds and it was pretty bad too. Moving with a constant speed doesn't go well with PVP. Example:

https://youtu.be/bzVfWOshxio?si=4Rz_nzTUubqdNE_b

There were more fights in the winter, at least I recall one more right next to Hentai village, but I never enjoyed them. The result was pretty much based on stats and the number of fighters, while outside winter it's not uncommon to see a well organized group winning fights with a more numerous opponent. And it's easier to run away.

[AriZona]

....
You have one and so does your enemy. You both move with equal speed so you'll never catch anyone, but you can't really escape either.
....

Shouldnt be that PVPers seek each other to fight? Why do you all "PVPers" pretend that PVP is what you live for, but always run from each other (unless u meed x10 weaker noob)? So much fuss how winter is bad for PVP across threads, but it turns out you playing tag... This yet another manifest that H&H should be redesigned to PVE. All those pseudo-PVPers are just noob harassers and meta to this game.

[SnuggleSnail]

GRUG NO RESPECT TACTICS OR SKILL, SHOULD STAND NEXT TO EACH OTHER AND BASH FACE OR YOU COWARD. SMALLER STAT MAN DIE. THIS WAY GOD INTENDED.

[Robben_DuMarsch]

Shouldnt be that PVPers seek each other to fight? Why do you all "PVPers" pretend that PVP is what you live for, but always run from each other (unless u meed x10 weaker noob)? So much fuss how winter is bad for PVP across threads, but it turns out you playing tag... This yet another manifest that H&H should be redesigned to PVE. All those pseudo-PVPers are just noob harassers and meta to this game.

There are lots of games out there that provide balanced PvP, with a lot of skill expression, transparent ranking, and better combat. Some even have good economics, sandbox elements, and other positive features.

Haven does a lot of things well, but a balanced competitive experience is only tangential to Haven's actual gameplay loop. It's fair to say that PvP and competition is a driving force behind a lot of systems, albeit not by design the main attraction.

People who play HnH primarily for the PvP are able to play those other games, but instead choose to play Haven "for the PvP."

Infer from that what you will.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I personally enjoy the challenge of punching up, rather than the easy wins of punching down. I get that in Haven specifically by fighting on behalf of, rather than against, the newbs and hermits.

There are some PvPers that dislike winter because it changes the PvP paradigm from one where you can easily and freely escape most situations with a combination of speed buffs and critter clicking, as long as you have enough practice and client modifications.

[Detharon]

Shouldnt be that PVPers seek each other to fight? Why do you all "PVPers" pretend that PVP is what you live for, but always run from each other (unless u meed x10 weaker noob)? So much fuss how winter is bad for PVP across threads, but it turns out you playing tag... This yet another manifest that H&H should be redesigned to PVE. All those pseudo-PVPers are just noob harassers and meta to this game.

I actually spend most of my time doing stuff in the village, killing trolls, cooking, raising quality or whatnot.

The thing is, all of it would go in vain if my village had nobody to defend it. This game wasn't designed around the PVP, but it was always an important part of it. I'm puzzled why people ignore it and then they complain. Same goes for basic village security.

Still, I want a meaningful fight rather than a stat check followed by pointless clicking on the map until either I or my opponent dies out of boredom.

[Robben_DuMarsch]

Still, I want a meaningful fight rather than a stat check followed by pointless clicking on the map until either I or my opponent dies out of boredom.

That's probably a fair critique of boats as well, but we still have Snekkjas year round.

The snow situation would probably be improved if there were periodic patches of "muddy/rocky snow" that would catch your vehicles, which would appear with enough frequency to force a bail out and end a straight line stall if you ran into a solid line of them.

We could also add little patches of turbulent water to at least force direction changes in water to eventually allow Snekkja chases to end too.

What would you propose, status quo or overhaul?

[Detharon]

Still, I want a meaningful fight rather than a stat check followed by pointless clicking on the map until either I or my opponent dies out of boredom.

That's probably a fair critique of boats as well, but we still have Snekkjas year round.

The snow situation would probably be improved if there were periodic patches of "muddy/rocky snow" that would catch your vehicles, which would appear with enough frequency to force a bail out and end a straight line stall if you ran into a solid line of them.

We could also add little patches of turbulent water to at least force direction changes in water to eventually allow Snekkja chases to end too.

What would you propose, status quo or overhaul?

Yes, boats also have the same problem, but fighting on them is mostly optional. Most people jump off and fight on ground anyway, also it's possible to just leave the Snekkja and escape the usual way, with speedbuffs and critters. During the winter there's no way to opt out of it.

Winter PVP would be better if we couldn't use the vehicles the same way that horses can't be used in a regular fight. Idk, maybe rawhide should affect reindeers, and there should be a new hearth magic that freezes and damages all the skis, kicksleds and sleighs. Maybe then the winter events could be a possibility, but winter still wouldn't be fun overall. It has other problems, such as removing plenty of content and providing almost nothing in exchange: one decent curio, some useless curio, one gilding that's not worth the time to get. Questing during winter sucks because even simple tasks like catching a dragonfly or raiding an ant hill are not possible.

[Dawidio123]

Winter PVP would be better if we couldn't use the vehicles the same way that horses can't be used in a regular fight. Idk, maybe rawhide should affect reindeers, and there should be a new hearth magic that freezes and damages all the skis, kicksleds and sleighs. Maybe then the winter events could be a possibility, but winter still wouldn't be fun overall. It has other problems, such as removing plenty of content and providing almost nothing in exchange: one decent curio, some useless curio, one gilding that's not worth the time to get. Questing during winter sucks because even simple tasks like catching a dragonfly or raiding an ant hill are not possible.

Pretty much this, no matter how much you try to fix winter it's just an inferior version of the default game and applying bandaids like "oh let's make the unique winter stuff not usable" is just a soft way of saying "the game would be better without winter"