Outfits.

[Jackard]

I hope not, at least not in the classical sense of classes. I find the system very restrictive.

We aren't told much about Credos and how they will function. We've been told they will be remarkably unique and I believe that in the very least you have little to worry about them adopting any system of 'traditional classes'. Still, they're essentially classes even if they're not traditional or they're called by a different name. I'm sure in the end we'll be able to finger warriors, rogues, priests etc. because traditional classes are based around core dynamics. Calling them restrictive is based around the implementations of games you have previously experienced. Try Shadowbane. Their system of classes, proffessions and races are anythign but restrictive. There is such a crazy number of permutations that keeping your builds discreet is actually a viable PvP & GvG strategy. All this despite most classes being quite traditional and professions only slightly less so. I believe the devs are capable of designing a system with such complexity and diversity even if nothing in the game currently reflects that.

guild wars had a pretty nice class system too

[Alamarian]

I prefer an open ended skill based system to a class system. If balanced properly, it achieves the effect of a class system (creating a core playstyle for a character) while allowing much more freedom of choice. It's a big if, classes are easier to balance. Properly done, classes can be made almost as interesting, though I don't know if I would pick SB or GW. It's been too long since I played either.

[Chakravanti]

guild wars had a pretty nice class system too

Haven't played it but I heard lots of good things about it. Thing is, even classless systems end up with classes. e.g. Runescape. Truly classless ends up as just a comparison of numbers with no cooperative strategy element.

[Neruz]

The problem with having no restrictions on skills (Classes are just a way to restrict abilities and skills) is that if the skills are capped, eventually everyone will have full everything, rendering all top-tier characters exactly the same. If the skills are not capped, then you a handful of runaway players that are just so far above and beyond everyone else that nothing can touch them (this is the problem we have at the moment.)

[Jackard]

The problem with having no restrictions on skills (Classes are just a way to restrict abilities and skills) is that if the skills are capped, eventually everyone will have full everything, rendering all top-tier characters exactly the same. If the skills are not capped, then you a handful of runaway players that are just so far above and beyond everyone else that nothing can touch them (this is the problem we have at the moment.)

there are more things in heaven and earth than are dreamt of in your philosophy

two really easy examples come to mind: skills that bar you from taking other skills and systems that only allow you to use a portion of your abilities at any one time

[Neruz]

The problem with having no restrictions on skills (Classes are just a way to restrict abilities and skills) is that if the skills are capped, eventually everyone will have full everything, rendering all top-tier characters exactly the same. If the skills are not capped, then you a handful of runaway players that are just so far above and beyond everyone else that nothing can touch them (this is the problem we have at the moment.)

there are more things in heaven and earth than are dreamt of in your philosophy

two really easy examples come to mind: skills that bar you from taking other skills and systems that only allow you to use a portion of your abilities at any one time

Both of which are restrictions. Thankyou for agreeing with me.

[Jackard]

hmm it sounded as though you meant 'capping' was the only way to restrict skills

i cant think of many skill-based games that dont have restrictions of some sort

[Neruz]

If that's what it sounded like; it wasn't what i meant. Capping doesn't even restrict skills since all capping means is that eventually all the high level players have max everything.

i cant think of many skill-based games that dont have restrictions of some sort

That's because it doesn't work.

[Jackard]

If that's what it sounded like; it wasn't what i meant. Capping doesn't even restrict skills since all capping means is that eventually all the high level players have max everything.

¿?

theres more than one sort of capping. like this one game where players picked five talents and then ordered them from strongest to weakest...

[Alamarian]

The problem with having no restrictions on skills (Classes are just a way to restrict abilities and skills) is that if the skills are capped, eventually everyone will have full everything, rendering all top-tier characters exactly the same. If the skills are not capped, then you a handful of runaway players that are just so far above and beyond everyone else that nothing can touch them (this is the problem we have at the moment.)

Or you can cap the total number of skills/skill points/whatever, like Ultima Online. (Which is no different than capping levels for a class based system)