Per Jorb's request: Austin VS WB Discourse

[Zampfeo]

Let it be clear that I am no way defending his actions/behaviour, but I am just wondering where we should draw the line as a community. What if he was 19 and she was 15, would it still be completely wrong or already less wrong? Do we follow Swedish law, American law or Russian law?

Despite Sweden's age of consent being 15, a 20 year old having sex with a 15 year old would get the same exact treatment in real life. There is still social consequences despite no legal consequences.

[Dawidio123]

I have a sincere question for the ones defending Misa:

Suppose he had done it to a 7 yo instead, and it was also legal here. Would you still be on his side?

What if he was 19 and she was 15

Let's go with the age/2+7 rule (assuming 15+, i hate that i have to specify this) as a generic guideline. It's not perfect and you can surely find some breakpoints where it'll seem weird, but if your age doesn't comply with it, it's bad.

[Vraatjuh]

Let it be clear that I am no way defending his actions/behaviour, but I am just wondering where we should draw the line as a community. What if he was 19 and she was 15, would it still be completely wrong or already less wrong? Do we follow Swedish law, American law or Russian law?

Despite Sweden's age of consent being 15, a 20 year old having sex with a 15 year old would get the same exact treatment in real life. There is still social consequences despite no legal consequences.

It's the same in the Netherlands, but I haven't seen any outrage in my teenage years when a 15 year old hooked up with a 19/20 year old at all. Something that happened more than occassionally, since 15-year olds also went to pubs/clubs already.
And no, that wasn't me. I stayed a virgin much longer than that.
I assume there is also a reason they drew a line around that age legally. And yes, that means that in our culture 23 is definitely too old in this case as well. But that doesn't really answer my question(s) at all.

[Dawidio123]

It's the same in the Netherlands, but I haven't seen any outrage in my teenage years when a 15 year old hooked up with a 19/20 year old at all. Something that happened more than occassionally, since 15-year olds also went to pubs/clubs already.

Yeah because a lot of men are fucking creeps. If my 20 years old friend had a 15 years old gf I would probably stop being friends with him.

[Vraatjuh]

It's the same in the Netherlands, but I haven't seen any outrage in my teenage years when a 15 year old hooked up with a 19/20 year old at all. Something that happened more than occassionally, since 15-year olds also went to pubs/clubs already.

Yeah because a lot of men are fucking creeps. If my 20 years old friend had a 15 years old gf I would probably stop being friends with him.

Again, where do you draw the line? Are you fine with blatant racist friends or people who have nazi flags hanging in their house? Should we kick Misa out of this community and live on jolly and happy or try to actually make this a slightly better place for everyone around?

[TheServant]

I have a sincere question for the ones defending Misa:

Suppose he had done it to a 7 yo instead, and it was also legal here. Would you still be on his side?

Let it be clear that I am no way defending his actions/behaviour, but I am just wondering where we should draw the line as a community. What if he was 19 and she was 15, would it still be completely wrong or already less wrong? Do we follow Swedish law, American law or Russian law? Do we draw the line at pedophelia or are we also going to exclude people who commit other very questionable life choices. Is it enough to take a stance as a community to exclude them or do we want them removed from the game altogether?

I've seen plenty cyberbullying, blatant racism and nazism that would be considered a crime in my country, but in this community it is almost deemed normal. The way loli girls are sexualized seems to be fine behaviour, even though in my eyes is quite concerning as well.

If the argument is creating a safe space for teenagers then maybe it's not only sexual predotarial behaviour we should be targetting. But for some reason this is the only thing ever questioned here.

These people harassed me for months even before, this has nothing to do about moral concern. They have many pedo jokes in their client, a lot of racist shit and all edgy stuff in their discord, thats why we dont bother trying to argue anything cause theyre here for the lulz. Nobody that would care about this regard would act like this. Rawrz discord banned me and prohibit italking about it, which would be the only sane response if one really had any concern. These trolls couldnt control themselves and made another discord over this. Theres doxxing talk, racism and lots of shit over there. They even made memes with "Misa and 14yo novinha" and a cavehole. Its funny cause many of them would be arrested irl over the shit they do there.

[Luno]

I have a sincere question for the ones defending Misa:

Suppose he had done it to a 7 yo instead, and it was also legal here. Would you still be on his side?

Let it be clear that I am no way defending his actions/behaviour, but I am just wondering where we should draw the line as a community. What if he was 19 and she was 15, would it still be completely wrong or already less wrong? Do we follow Swedish law, American law or Russian law? Do we draw the line at pedophelia or are we also going to exclude people who commit other very questionable life choices. Is it enough to take a stance as a community to exclude them or do we want them removed from the game altogether?

I've seen plenty cyberbullying, blatant racism and nazism that would be considered a crime in my country, but in this community it is almost deemed normal. The way loli girls are sexualized seems to be fine behaviour, even though in my eyes is quite concerning as well.

If the argument is creating a safe space for teenagers then maybe it's not only sexual predotarial behaviour we should be targetting. But for some reason this is the only thing ever questioned here.

You ignored my question entirely.
Would you still be asking those stupid questions had he done it to a 7 yo? Or would'nt that be obvious that it's wrong?
If you are asking me those questions, and admit that fuckin a 7yo is clearly not okay, i can only assume that you stand in the same position as Misa, where it is not really about the laws of my country, but that you actually think that there is a possibility that fuckin 15 yos is okay.
But if you think that fuckin a 7 yo is fine if the law says so, then, yeah, it's better if you continue to ignore the question.
So, what is it?

[Zampfeo]

Let it be clear that I am no way defending his actions/behaviour, but I am just wondering where we should draw the line as a community. What if he was 19 and she was 15, would it still be completely wrong or already less wrong? Do we follow Swedish law, American law or Russian law?

Despite Sweden's age of consent being 15, a 20 year old having sex with a 15 year old would get the same exact treatment in real life. There is still social consequences despite no legal consequences.

It's the same in the Netherlands, but I haven't seen any outrage in my teenage years when a 15 year old hooked up with a 19/20 year old at all. Something that happened more than occassionally, since 15-year olds also went to pubs/clubs already.
And no, that wasn't me. I stayed a virgin much longer than that.
I assume there is also a reason they drew a line around that age legally. And yes, that means that in our culture 23 is definitely too old in this case as well. But that doesn't really answer my question(s) at all.

The social ostracization is targeted towards the 20 year old by their own, older peers. As a 15 year old, you wouldn't be privy to it.

[Dawidio123]

These people harassed me for months even before, this has nothing to do about moral concern.

Nobody harrased you more than the usual jabs before you outed yourself. Well tbf you were also a scammer and a piece of shit before the whole thing.

They have many pedo jokes in their client,

Whose client? Havoc doesn't have that so not me.

a lot of racist shit and all edgy stuff in their discord, thats why we dont bother trying to argue anything cause theyre here for the lulz. Nobody that would care about this regard would act like this. Rawrz discord banned me and prohibit italking about it, which would be the only sane response if one really had any concern.

No there isn't, it's actually more moderated than the old one. You won't see giant nwords in the meme channel left for weeks to fester. I think trying to remove you from this community is quite sane for the safety of newcomers (btw are you saying nobody in WB has any concerns about what you said back then?). Btw it's funny how you dm'd every single girl in the community you fucking creep.

These trolls couldnt control themselves and made another discord over this.

It was made because of other things, not everything is centered around you. Well I personally did get banned over this as a scapegoat but thinking the new discord was made bcs of me is flattering but probably not true.

Theres doxxing talk, racism and lots of shit over there.

No there isn't, once again. You can't even join it because you are banned so how would you even know. Ofc it's edgy as any hafen discord, but compared to every other one it's actually pretty well kept.

They even made memes with "Misa and 14yo novinha" and a cavehole.

Yep. And you REDACTED a kid.

Its funny cause many of them would be arrested irl over the shit they do there.

Report it to the proper authorities or smth.

[Vraatjuh]

I have a sincere question for the ones defending Misa:

Suppose he had done it to a 7 yo instead, and it was also legal here. Would you still be on his side?

Let it be clear that I am no way defending his actions/behaviour, but I am just wondering where we should draw the line as a community. What if he was 19 and she was 15, would it still be completely wrong or already less wrong? Do we follow Swedish law, American law or Russian law? Do we draw the line at pedophelia or are we also going to exclude people who commit other very questionable life choices. Is it enough to take a stance as a community to exclude them or do we want them removed from the game altogether?

I've seen plenty cyberbullying, blatant racism and nazism that would be considered a crime in my country, but in this community it is almost deemed normal. The way loli girls are sexualized seems to be fine behaviour, even though in my eyes is quite concerning as well.

If the argument is creating a safe space for teenagers then maybe it's not only sexual predotarial behaviour we should be targetting. But for some reason this is the only thing ever questioned here.

You ignored my question entirely.
Would you still be asking those stupid questions had he done it to a 7 yo? Or would'nt that be obvious that it's wrong?
If you are asking me those questions, and admit that fuckin a 7yo is clearly not okay, i can only assume that you stand in the same position as Misa, where it is not really about the laws of my country, but that you actually think that there is a possibility that fuckin 15 yos is okay.
But if you think that fuckin a 7 yo is fine if the law says so, then, yeah, it's better if you continue to ignore the question.
So, what is it?

Yes, I would still be asking these questions. Because my point is not about wether he is wrong or not by our (and my) moral standards, because he obviously is both for 7 and 15 years old. But about the insane amount of hypocrisy involving this case. If we are so involved in this community and wanting to make it a safer space. Why stop with this case? Why have we normalized so much of the other stuff in the past.