New Resource System

[SeanPan]

it wasn't in world 3. it was pretty meaningful in world 4, though.

I'll take your word for it.

And I think that exploration is and should be important in 4x games. After all, you should eXplore, eXpand, eXploit, and finally be eXterminated by Sodom.

[ImpalerWrG]

Seems people agree that surface resource nodes (clay, soil, water) are now like the Mines of world 3, snatched up in the first week of the game by the lucky or elite groups and ownership of them ends up being highly determinative of a groups quality levels.

OP acknowledges that Mines have largely been fixed, as they are now based on a combination of luck AND depth which is a heavy resource investment, any spot is now about equally good for longer term success in mining or at least appear so. Why not apply this principle to the other resources. Some kind of resource investment asks as a gateway to higher raw materials, it might not be possible to have the same cost as mine shafts but in principle it could work.

Clay could come from Clay pit, Water from wells, the hand collected stuff then becomes the low level stuff equivalent to mining in a cave.

[pyrale]

Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2011 1:50 pm

Because it takes years of playing this game to understand such basic things as :
-Walls are cheap enough to surround massive zones. I have no trouble with how well they defend an area, but the size of the area is simply insane. One can basically live within this area and harvest enough LPs to sustain a village, without problem.
-Village claims basically cost nothing to sustain
-Personal claims are fine, except they're a pain in the ass to remove compared to the required investment. It's also really annoying that they prevent decay, so that colonies abandoned for weeks are still persistent.

It is also no wonder that smaller factions are griefed on a regular basis by larger factions...

I would like to see measures to restrict permanent village claim sizes, and to add new types of village claim extentions, that would be temporary and/or breakable and/or less easily defendable, with the possibility to create these out of the initial village claim area.
Also, it could be interesting to make ressource nodes temporary (aka removing ressource regeneration) with the possibility for new ressource nodes to appear randomly anywhere.

I think the combination of those two factors would help alot to create an interesting endgame, by forcing factions to constantly fight for remote, less defendable ressources to keep their power, and by allowing newcomers to settle with a chance to catch up someday. It would also give much more power to casuals and smaller groups, because making friends with them would give a much better exploration power.

[barra]

Seems people agree that surface resource nodes (clay, soil, water) are now like the Mines of world 3, snatched up in the first week of the game by the lucky or elite groups and ownership of them ends up being highly determinative of a groups quality levels.

OP acknowledges that Mines have largely been fixed, as they are now based on a combination of luck AND depth which is a heavy resource investment, any spot is now about equally good for longer term success in mining or at least appear so. Why not apply this principle to the other resources. Some kind of resource investment asks as a gateway to higher raw materials, it might not be possible to have the same cost as mine shafts but in principle it could work.

Clay could come from Clay pit, Water from wells, the hand collected stuff then becomes the low level stuff equivalent to mining in a cave.

I agree completely. The W4 mining changes were the BEST thing I've seen added to this game since I started. The slope of progression still existed, but it didn't have the problem of W3 where someone could prospect a grid solo in a day or two and find every mine outside of a cave. The new stuff was also fun.

W5's curio/discovery system is a bit unintuitive but has the convenience of allowing some offline play and might be enough to stop the bots.

I've spent most of my first week of this world chasing water/soil/clay nodes across my supergrid and honestly even after I found a nice one camping on top of it and trying to fight off everyone who has the same idea and wants to park next door isn't fun. I don't know what to suggest as an improvement, but I'd like to see a change.

[sabinati]

Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2011 1:50 pm

Because it takes years of playing this game to understand such basic things as :
-Walls are cheap enough to surround massive zones. I have no trouble with how well they defend an area, but the size of the area is simply insane. One can basically live within this area and harvest enough LPs to sustain a village, without problem.
-Village claims basically cost nothing to sustain
-Personal claims are fine, except they're a pain in the ass to remove compared to the required investment. It's also really annoying that they prevent decay, so that colonies abandoned for weeks are still persistent.

It is also no wonder that smaller factions are griefed on a regular basis by larger factions...

I would like to see measures to restrict permanent village claim sizes, and to add new types of village claim extentions, that would be temporary and/or breakable and/or less easily defendable, with the possibility to create these out of the initial village claim area.
Also, it could be interesting to make ressource nodes temporary (aka removing ressource regeneration) with the possibility for new ressource nodes to appear randomly anywhere.

I think the combination of those two factors would help alot to create an interesting endgame, by forcing factions to constantly fight for remote, less defendable ressources to keep their power, and by allowing newcomers to settle with a chance to catch up someday. It would also give much more power to casuals and smaller groups, because making friends with them would give a much better exploration power.

if you think you know anything about pvp or politics after 1 month, you are wrong

[pyrale]

if you think you know anything about pvp or politics after 1 month, you are wrong

Do you even read what people write or ?

[evilrich]

if you think you know anything about pvp or politics after 1 month, you are wrong

Do you even read what people write or ?

thou shalt not question the wisdom of sabinati. he knows what hes talking about, even if he is a bit rough around the edges occasionally

[sabinati]

if you think you know anything about pvp or politics after 1 month, you are wrong

Do you even read what people write or ?

nope, i don't have time to read, look at my postcount!

[ImpalerWrG]

Because it takes years of playing this game to understand such basic things as :
-Walls are cheap enough to surround massive zones. I have no trouble with how well they defend an area, but the size of the area is simply insane. One can basically live within this area and harvest enough LPs to sustain a village, without problem.
-Village claims basically cost nothing to sustain
-Personal claims are fine, except they're a pain in the ass to remove compared to the required investment. It's also really annoying that they prevent decay, so that colonies abandoned for weeks are still persistent.

It is also no wonder that smaller factions are griefed on a regular basis by larger factions...

I would like to see measures to restrict permanent village claim sizes, and to add new types of village claim extentions, that would be temporary and/or breakable and/or less easily defendable, with the possibility to create these out of the initial village claim area.
Also, it could be interesting to make ressource nodes temporary (aka removing ressource regeneration) with the possibility for new ressource nodes to appear randomly anywhere.

I think the combination of those two factors would help alot to create an interesting endgame, by forcing factions to constantly fight for remote, less defendable ressources to keep their power, and by allowing newcomers to settle with a chance to catch up someday. It would also give much more power to casuals and smaller groups, because making friends with them would give a much better exploration power.

Just ignore the Trolls, especially the large Green ones

I agree with your point on walls, I think the solution is to drop the high initial post costs down to the cost of a normal Post but increase the linear segment costs and require secondary materials for them. 5 Blocks and a String for Palisade, 20 Bricks and a Hard Metal Nugget for Brick sections. This would make total cost far more linear with wall length.

Village claims cost nothing cause the payment method is just piggybacked on the one thing players are doing constantly all the time getting LP. Their was a thread discussing a possible village level Curio concept, the Curios might be put in the Idol or they might be Constructions that last a limited time. The point is players have to take time and resources from their personal LP Grind to maintain the village instead.

Personal Claims I think are flawed in being based on LP, for one its a terribly exploitable LP bank around Death. Second its a completely Linear system, I saw a personal Claim covering an entire LAKE last world, it was at least a couple million LP. I think having Claim size linked with a new Stat, call it WillPower and you can claim 10 tiles per point. This lets a newbie claim a modest 10x10 while making the monster Claims effectively impossible. Inheritors can retain a claim over their WillPower but can't expand it till they have raised WillPower sufficiently, this eliminates LP banking as well.

[pyrale]

I agree with your point on walls, I think the solution is to drop the high initial post costs down to the cost of a normal Post but increase the linear segment costs and require secondary materials for them. 5 Blocks and a String for Palisade, 20 Bricks and a Hard Metal Nugget for Brick sections. This would make total cost far more linear with wall length.

The thing is, even with increased wall costs, people would still be able to build insane amounts of walls, because it's a one-time cost. Even adding nuggets, people would still brickwall places that are bigger than what they need, and that is bigger than what they should get :p.
The solution in my opinion would be that those buildings require an upkeep, so that by brickwalling a large area, you effectively tap a sizeable part of your workforce. A good option would be that decay isn't prevented by village claims.
However, to ease the repairing process, you could have an option to repair all the buildings from the village idol.