Daggers/Wooden Swords/Spears(Due to Input)

[Kriegwolf]

I read that several times already. Just didn't get what you said (skill use is not obviously skill speed). Don't you think that daggers would be faster than UA, then? That sounds kinda hilarious. Oh and... If dagger would give a high enough speed bonus, we get tons of dagger soldiers. If dagger would give a low enough speed bonus, we get daggers abandoned, cause swordsmen will just one-hit rape the dagger users. And with THESE people, daggers will get an absurdly high bonus (See how we raise our dex/agi to 100500). And anyway, wasn't there a speed bonus for agi already?

[ImAwesome]

skill use wouldn't mean just speed, but amount of ip used...example valorous strike takes 6 ip while using that skill with a sword or axe, hes suggesting maybe 5(or 4 or 3 or maybe even 2? based on attribute levels) since daggers aren't quite as unweildly as a larger heavier weapon...

[Phoenix246]

I might be coming in late ,but I like the idea of having something inbetween axes and metal swords.

[jordancoles]

I read that several times already. Just didn't get what you said (skill use is not obviously skill speed). Don't you think that daggers would be faster than UA, then? That sounds kinda hilarious. Oh and... If dagger would give a high enough speed bonus, we get tons of dagger soldiers. If dagger would give a low enough speed bonus, we get daggers abandoned, cause swordsmen will just one-hit rape the dagger users. And with THESE people, daggers will get an absurdly high bonus (See how we raise our dex/agi to 100500). And anyway, wasn't there a speed bonus for agi already?

Again you miss the point completely, it's a stepping stone towards a sword, or it could be used as its own weapon all together, duel wield a dagger and a sword if you want and use the skill that best fits the situation. I never said it'd be faster than UA, I said that its speed would be shorter than other weapons for cooldowns. Which is obvious since a heavy sword vs a quick dagger makes sense. A cut to damage for a gain in speed, that's the objective. Not neck cuts or anything like that, perhaps a "stab" instead of sting, taking 1-2 IP but not much else.

[Kriegwolf]

Then, again, we come to the uselessness of daggers. Why would i use a dagger if i can add another metal bar and get a sword? Gain in speed should affect all skills (then it appears faster than UA), or just attack skills like sting and val. strike (which makes daggers lame because i'd better do more damage then get a 2% add to speed, 'cause i am going to raise my attack bar again and again and it takes more time anyway). Also, spears ARE superior weapon (you don't even need skills to rape a swordsman and surely a guy with a dagger).

Probably you could say that daggers give you some addition to melee skill, 'cause even a noob can kill someone not-so-skilled with a dagger, and yep, dagger in offhand also acts like a both parrying and attacking thing, giving you a little bonus to attack and defense weights.

And oh yeah, no sane person would attack a swordsman with just a dagger, that's suicide.

Some words about wooden sword: well THAT was nowhere near common sense if suggesting it as something between stone axes and normal swords. In fact, wooden sword is a club. Sharp-edged, yeah, but still a club. So the most reasonable use of it is to use it like a very, very short spear, and even then you'd better poke your enemy in his eyes. Otherwise stone axe wins due to it's balance, weight, and, well, it might not break after the first serious hit.

Also, i demand zweihanders, they are awesome. And spears again. They are even more awesome.

[jordancoles]

Then, again, we come to the uselessness of daggers. Why would i use a dagger if i can add another metal bar and get a sword? Gain in speed should affect all skills (then it appears faster than UA), or just attack skills like sting and val. strike (which makes daggers lame because i'd better do more damage then get a 2% add to speed, 'cause i am going to raise my attack bar again and again and it takes more time anyway). Also, spears ARE superior weapon (you don't even need skills to rape a swordsman and surely a guy with a dagger).

Probably you could say that daggers give you some addition to melee skill, 'cause even a noob can kill someone not-so-skilled with a dagger, and yep, dagger in offhand also acts like a both parrying and attacking thing, giving you a little bonus to attack and defense weights.

And oh yeah, no sane person would attack a swordsman with just a dagger, that's suicide.

Some words about wooden sword: well THAT was nowhere near common sense if suggesting it as something between stone axes and normal swords. In fact, wooden sword is a club. Sharp-edged, yeah, but still a club. So the most reasonable use of it is to use it like a very, very short spear, and even then you'd better poke your enemy in his eyes. Otherwise stone axe wins due to it's balance, weight, and, well, it might not break after the first serious hit.

Also, i demand zweihanders, they are awesome. And spears again. They are even more awesome.

A wooden sword. http://www.google.ca/imgres?q=wooden+sw ... 9,r:12,s:0
I'm NOT talking about realism, in hnh dragonflies are the size of your head, along with frogs and sign posts can hold tons of materials in a 1x1 square. There is no realism in this. If you add realism to a permadeath game you only get more death and pvp which detracts from the rest of the game. This is already a huge problem. WOODEN swords are just that. A sword that is easily craftable which gives access to sting. It's NOT for killing people or breaking armor, it's a hunting and training tool. A stepping stone. You're just adding in facts as if I've said them with every post :/ I'm leaving this thread now, if Jorbtar likes the ideas they can pick it apart however they like but my basic idea stands.

[Kriegwolf]

Why would i need access to sting? Punch eats up less initiative

[jordancoles]

Why would i need access to sting? Punch eats up less initiative

And it also doesn't kill a boar in one hit, gawww

[MagicManICT]

Why would i need access to sting? Punch eats up less initiative

And it also doesn't kill a boar in one hit, gawww

It does if I have ungodly strength. Bad argument. FYI, it wasn't unusual to see people with 1k+ Strength halfway through w3. They were breaking brick walls by hand (well, with a sledgehammer equipped)!!

The point is that punch only does a base of 37.5 vs 50 of a stone axe and 250 of a militia sword. There's a definite need for something between those two weapons.

[jordancoles]

Why would i need access to sting? Punch eats up less initiative

And it also doesn't kill a boar in one hit, gawww

It does if I have ungodly strength. Bad argument. FYI, it wasn't unusual to see people with 1k+ Strength halfway through w3. They were breaking brick walls by hand (well, with a sledgehammer equipped)!!

The point is that punch only does a base of 37.5 vs 50 of a stone axe and 250 of a militia sword. There's a definite need for something between those two weapons.

As a new player your strength would hardly let you punch a running fox in one hit yet alone a boar, which is where the need comes in