At the Crossroads of what is and what could be?

[sMartins]

Can you give examples of games that were able to effectively stop alts?
Anti-cheating systems only deter individuals lacking the technical expertise to circumvent them

We all know that, but that does not mean that we should not fight back.

[Zampfeo]

Games 20 years ago stopped alts.

This is not true. At all.

In WoW people alt different classes and primary professions.
In Eve people alt PVP and industry pilots.
Even multiboxing is legal in both WoW and EVE
In OSRS people alt mains and pures. (not that this is necessary seeing as OSRS is one of the few MMOs that your main can actually do everything)

The difference between these games and Haven is the developers have designed their games to make alting unnecessary for normal gameplay.

[sMartins]

This is not true. At all.

In WoW people alt different classes and primary professions.
In Eve people alt PVP and industry pilots.
Even multiboxing is legal in both WoW and EVE
In OSRS people alt mains and pures. (not that this is necessary seeing as OSRS is one of the few MMOs that your main can actually do everything)

The difference between these games and Haven is the developers have designed their games to make alting unnecessary for normal gameplay.

Alting is not so bad if kept at bay, of course.

The worst thing are the custom clients and related bots, as they alter the gaming experience ... the game board, if you like.

[DonVelD]

Don't hate the player, hate the game.

If you disagree, click this button:

[sMartins]

Don't hate the player, hate the game.

This is true, but then there are also those who hide behind it and those who use this as justification to give their worst.

[terechgracz]

Those who can't do, yap.

[sMartins]

Those who can't do, yap.

Also, right .... first right thing you say. This is a profound issue.

And that is precisely the point, those who can should not do ... how to tell them though? Not to do to those who can do, we have not yet found the way.

Not even in a game ...

[sMartins]

Yes, beautifully written my friend ... the problem with your story is that it doesn't last forever as you seem to suggest ... it would be a bit too long to go into details, I'm just saying that this vision is suggested by the context in which we are now and which has brought us so far, consequently of how we think now, but it doesn't have to be that way.

One step at a time, one step at a time ... the point is not to give up.

The Greeks, for example, had chained Loftar for a reason .
Even if metaphysics is dead, we now have the genealogy with which we must shed light on why things happen and on which path we must set out, because from now on it will be up to us alone.

[Audiosmurf]

I literally am in love with smartins

[Nocturnal-Rainbows]

Can you give examples of games that were able to effectively stop alts?
Anti-cheating systems only deter individuals lacking the technical expertise to circumvent them

Ultima Online private shards I played only allowed 1 account per household (you could message them and be allowed another account if you had a family member or whatever in the house who wanted an account too, but that was all) and there was no account sharing allowed.
They caught people account sharing/using alt accounts easily as fuck. I didn't even know there was a no-account sharing rule until I got one of the fisher/tamer accounts I used banned.

Same thing can be said with games like Lineage 2. Now I don't know what the official servers stance on alts is, maybe it's allowed, maybe it isn't, I wouldn't know, I've never played it but some of the servers I've been on did not allow alt accounts, and there's a good reason for that. There are buffer/healer classes that people would dual box with if alt accounts were allowed, so they'd have their support character in party on auto follow behind them while they killed shit and leveled both up (holy shit I'm getting nostalgic and want to play L2 again now). Whereas the above example was seen all over the place when leveling on those servers, on the servers with no alt accounts allowed, that shit never happened.

The UO shard I played on did have AFK anti-macro rules, BUT people did do that anyway, and sometimes you'd get caught, sometimes you wouldn't The AFK thing was basically something you'd do if you knew the GM's timezone and you'd throw a macro on and just hope you could get away with it. If not you'd get sent to jail for a bit and sometimes the GM would nuke your skill you was macroing.
The macro shit is irrelevant though, I don't give a fuck about botting in Haven & Hearth. Everything that people are botting now they can continue botting with for all I care, but make them do it on 1 character so they can't have alts handling all other aspects of the game while they're playing their main.
You shouldn't be able to have 1 bot out mapping the world, 1 bot visiting swamps for candleberries, other bots cutting down trees/terraforming the land, another few alts manning your spitroasting racks. Like gtfo with that. You wanna send your main out using your candleberry farming bot? Go for it, at least it's putting a character you actually care about out in danger.

This is not true. At all.

In WoW people alt different classes and primary professions.
In Eve people alt PVP and industry pilots.
Even multiboxing is legal in both WoW and EVE
In OSRS people alt mains and pures. (not that this is necessary seeing as OSRS is one of the few MMOs that your main can actually do everything)

What's not true about it? Those games allow alt accounts. If they allow it, what relevance does that have with what I'm suggesting? The games that don't allow alt accounts have very easy ways to circumvent most alt account usage.
Unlike those games too, Haven & Hearth has the worst alt abuse I have ever seen in any online game all my life, and I've played fucking tons of online games, I've seen and utilized multiboxing myself, most of the time alts aren't a big deal. In the Lineage 2 example up above I actually preferred servers that allowed you to use an alt so you could multibox a character that can buff your main.
Haven is completely different, alts run this game. Alts and automation make up the majority of peoples industry. Alts are a safe and free resource to do everything.

Also, Haven & Hearth has about as many players as the UO shards I played. Maybe not in the beginning but as the numbers dwindle after the first month it wouldn't be taxing on J&L to check in every so often and make sure nobody is blatantly bypassing any future alt account rule. The lions share of the work would be automated though and handled by an algorithm. Have it send out a ping to loftar if it detects one IP on two accounts and he can look into it and decide if any action should be taken.