Personal claims need to be weakened

[ApocalypsePlease]

Seeing as this thread is kind of a mesh of the suggestions of others, I'll pitch in with one I thought of earlier today. I kind of have an idea for dealing with LP banks, but this really does not help cover any of the other issues involved with claims, just LP banks.

What if, the LP spent into a claim is irretrievable as LP, but remains retrievable as claimed land. To simplify, when you purchase land for your claim, you "pay" for tiles. When you refund your claim, you don't get refunded the LP, but you keep that number of "paid tiles", so that the next time you place a claim, you do not need to pay for tiles until this new claim reaches the area you've got covered in "paid tiles", at which point more LP needs to be turned into "paid tiles". Essentially, you can keep putting in more and more LP to expand claim size. You will never lose the LP spent on expanding, but you will never be able to get it back as LP, only as area covered by a claim.

I've really tried to dissect any issues with this, but I feel I need others with different perspectives than mine to help see if this is a reasonable idea or not, you guys decide.

[DDDsDD999]

I still hold on to the hope that claims won't be extended through LP.

[ImpalerWrG]

I've always said we can learn a lot of the actual legal systems handling of abandonment of claims. This was a real problem in old England ware every scrap of land had been at one time or another in the possession of some hereditary nobility, but with all the plagues, wars, famines etc etc their was a lot of abandonment and people while their was no eternal 'force-field' their was a lot of risk of that anyone settling the abandoned land might be expelled by some owner coming out of the woodwork.

The solution was called 'Hostile Possession' basically the principle that if someone was making productive use of the land and the 'official' owner failed to protest or do anything to defend their rights then they would be forfeited to the one using the land.

Translated into game-speak, it simply means that claims decay not with TIME, but with SCENTS, specifically uncollected scents expiring. If someone is leaving scents on your claim and your not active enough to even collect it before it decays way then the claim authority meter takes a loss. The Claim owner doesn't need to hunt-down or punish the criminal, just collecting scents is considered adequate 'defense of rights', also anyone who has privileges on a claim can collect the scents to assist in defending the claim. If no one is violating the claim then no decay. Naturally their would be a per-day max loss, say around 1% so people can't blow away a claim with one big mass trespassing or mass robbery.

It's also far far more interactive, it's an activity normal players already do and which takes time and can't be handed off to a bunch of alts, rather then feeding some static timer your activity pushing back against the rest of the community. Another benefits to this system over time based decay of claims is that a larger claim takes more time to defend by walking it and looking for scents, and more desirable land will be violated more necessitating more vigilance and scent collection to maintain, and on a similar note the over-all rate of claim decay will be roughly proportional to population density in the game world as more people leave try to wipe away the abandoned claims. Villages should lose authority is exactly the same way.

[Cranny]

.....

Old toon leave scents with very high int * stealth, against a claim holder medium term player who is not able to see them with hes/hers medium perc * exp.
Lets not talk about new players that directly get shut out from claims in the case any old player wants the land, now at least have to make moves and some work to get it.

IDK if this could work. Hermits maybe just disappear.

[FictionRyu]

.....

Alot of people just go out collecting scents for the hell of it. If they did that, then that would mean they get that claim. What if they decide 'hey, this is good qsoil, imma horde it all to myself" ? Then what? That player is going to be more active then the last, but still have the massive claim. It just won't work.

[maze]

Understanding that people don't like working...

But claims are all over the world and really are an eye sore.

Claims from what I believe should be put under there own authority system.

What fuels the authority. a few chooses
A>Working system; such like the system on world 1-3, working on stuff will build your authority up.
B>Pill popping system; like the system of world 4-6 Curi pop give's you claim authority
C>Tax system; much like ancestors, you give up an item to your claim to fuel authority. (I'd pick this one the most as it remove's the bot logging, bot log on to work and bot log on to pop pills)
D>log on log off; log on reset counter.

--Just one thing on the Tax. like the ancestors but not really just as it. it should have 4-6 boxes with one or two boxes always being noobie items or stuff with the least amount of Authority gain. 2-3 box mid class and 5-6 high class.

To remove LP banks.
-Any lp put into a claim will be forever lost. But with a system like this I think the Claim should Bank lp so that the claim can change is area if it need to.

and lastly the bigger the claim the more your rent going to be.
You might have more authority but with more land more work is needed to keep it up.
IE; per 1 title = -X authority a day.

so a player starts off with a 5x5 land. 25 sq. let say thats 2500 claim authority.

so I beleave a player to be inactive at the point of 18 days or more. HnH is a MMO survival game, it should not be thought of other wise.
IE; you cant just walk away for 18 days and hope to come back to peaches and cream...dude you left your bread in the cupboard and now it's rotten sort'a deal.

math~
2500/18=138.888*
Your claim shall lose 138.888 per day. once it hits 0 it's gone.
so 1sq = 100 authority what I think should put on a tax of -7.5 authority a day per 1sq



Just my thoughts.
and again for the causal gamers

IE; you cant just walk away for 18 days and hope to come back to peaches and cream...dude you left your bread in the cupboard and now it's rotten sort'a deal.

Sorry to say but if your going to log off for 14+ days. go play farmville or get a bud to log on for you.

[Federico]

Having read the thread, I am here to suggest something:

What if village claims were made stronger?

Just give a group of people the ability to work together to get rid of a large personal claim. By being able to reduce their size gradually, paying more Auth. Their LS would just have to be able to walk into the claim stake, once it's covered by the vclaim and then right click it to reduce the radius of that claim by a small amount until they can afford a full declaim which would work like it does now (Except you dont get "You need 50000000 authority to declaim")

It would allow active players to take down these annoying claims.

[maze]

Having read everything in the thread, I am here to suggest this:

What if village claims were made stronger?

Just give a group of people the ability to work together to get rid of a large personal claim. By being able to reduce their size gradually, paying more Auth. Their LS would just have to be able to walk into the claim stake, once it's covered by the vclaim and then right click it to reduce the radius of that claim by a small amount until they can afford a full declaim which would work like it does now (Except you dont get "You need 50000000 authority to declaim")

thats all right for big city players...but the point I think were trying to get to is that, say everyone left hnh for 1 year. it should look as if the world was just restarted then.
That only come from decay or lost of Pclaims.

[ImpalerWrG]

Old toon leave scents with very high int * stealth, against a claim holder medium term player who is not able to see them with hes/hers medium perc * exp.
Lets not talk about new players that directly get shut out from claims in the case any old player wants the land, now at least have to make moves and some work to get it.

IDK if this could work. Hermits maybe just disappear.

If people have that high int * stealth then the claim as a means of defense is moot as your going to get robbed blind by this intruder. Also note that their would be a daily loss of authority cap as I stated and if your at all active you would be regaining authority (by what ever mechanism is chosen) and have the potential to offset the loss.

Alot of people just go out collecting scents for the hell of it. If they did that, then that would mean they get that claim. What if they decide 'hey, this is good qsoil, imma horde it all to myself" ? Then what? That player is going to be more active then the last, but still have the massive claim. It just won't work.

I never said that strangers who come along and collect scents from other people claims would obtain the claim. I said explicitly that you have to be a 'friendly' of the claim for your scent collection to contribute to defense of the claim. The only way to 'take' a claimed area is to completely decay away the old claim and then stake a new one, that's going to be impossible if the original owner is active, the intent is for the abandoned claims to decay away while active ones are preserved. Hording claims isn't possible because each character is still limited to one each and patrol/scent collection activity is required to defend each claim individual, more claims mean more time required.

[FictionRyu]

I said explicitly that you have to be a 'friendly' of the claim for your scent collection to contribute to defense of the claim.

Still won't help. People will make massive claims and not have a single person in that characters kin list. Thus avoiding the 'friendly' take-over.