A Question of Morality, and Custom Clients

[Scubas]

So, one of my best friends and I had a conversation yesterday about custom clients like Ender's, and graphics mods like Daji's.

My friend has used the default client for a long time now. He isn't ignorant of Ender's client, nor is he incapable of installing it and using it, as he has used it before. He just prefers to use the default client. I asked him why this is, and his response was:

(paraphrased) "Well, I feel like the mods in general take away from the way the game is supposed to be. The artwork is a little weird and unusual but it's a good kind of unusual, it's unique, and adds a lot of charm to the game. I also think that the way ender's client lets you hide objects and eliminate darkness is unfair, and takes away from certain elements of the game. What is the point of making a miner's helmet if you can flip a switch and disable darkness? What is the point of buying cartography, other than to get the other skills it relies on? With the vast majority of people using a custom client, it eliminates trading maps of the area with most people, and it also makes it where you have no personal need for it because you can make your own map in a separate file."

I do use Ender's client, however I actually agree with everything he's saying. I feel that some of the mods DO take away from the game (not daji's art, since that doesn't affect the gameplay itself.) particularly the night disabling. Even though it's a feature of Enders client that I do love for convenience's sake, the fact remains is that it changes the way the devs want the game to be. and what IS the point of a miner's helm, then? I can confirm that since I began in 2011, I have NEVER crafted a miner's helm, because I had absolutely no need to, and it would have been a waste of metal - Nor have I ever crafted a map of the area.

Eventually the argument devolved into me calling him Amish, and he calling me a cheater, among trading other insults (as our disagreements often turn.) It ended with me wishing that he and I could still be friends even though I use ender's client. He said yes, but only because I made him a backpack.

Anyhow. I wanted to ask the community, who I assume the vast majority of does in fact use Ender's or other clients, where do you stand on this? You don't have to side with Ender's just because you use it, same as I. Imo, I feel that it ruins certain aspects of the game, and it would be more interesting and more difficult without it. However I continue to use it to this day just for pure convinience (absolutely hate when I drop shit behind a tree and have to pixel hunt or else i'll bring up the flower menu), and because I really, really like Daji's art mod.

[Jackard]

There is no question here. As stated in the tutorial, custom clients are fully condoned by Seatribe. With their lack of interest
in improving the interface, this task is left to the playerbase.

• "What is the point of making a miner's helmet if you can flip a switch and disable darkness?
  What is the point of buying cartography, other than to get the other skills it relies on?"

Frankly, your friend sounds ignorant. Remind him that this alpha is four years old, just returning from abandonment and
many features (like those above) were only ever half-implemented to begin with.

[mister_vi]

You can use the Ender's client without utilizing any of the more cheaty bits. 'S what I do.

I use Ender soley because, frankly, the interface is a helluva lot easier to use, I can actually mute the bloody music and play my own awful playlist, and... Well, y'know. Full screen. Full screen is nice. Plus Daji's art mod makes the game much more enjoyable.

I can't really comment on the whole unfair advantage in mines because... Well frankly I'm a full nature hippy who doesn't particularly like stepping below ground. People will play how they want to play, I guess. And in the end, it's mostly just a shortcut.

[cobaltjones]

While the default client definitely has a certain charm to it, the simple fact is that the game is literally painful to play in any vast extent without using custom clients and their many useful features.

I agree that the use of custom clients completely removes the atmosphere and "feel" that the devs intended for the game to have, they're simple a necessary evil at this point.

[Weekly_Epic_Fail]

X-ray/hide object is not cheating to be as it is pretty illogical to only be hidden at the N/W/NW side of a rock or wall. Perhaps ctrl N takes the aspect out of mining but there isn't really much that can be done. As stated by loftar himself, he cannot really control people making custom clients to making things easier or making the UI. He also admit that his client is pretty crappy as well. I guess you can say that trying to control the client is like trying to stop water with your bare hands. Now I am not the computer savvy type but I think there could to be at least a way to put a finger on the leak of a sort but I don't think the devs are interested in that (has there been any success from an indie developer to do so?). Also, default client's window is way too tiny.

On another topic, you and your friend's opinion may differ but you at least should respect each other's opinion even if you don't agree with him. No sense of souring things up over an indie game.

[Scubas]

On another topic, you and your friend's opinion may differ but you at least should respect each other's opinion even if you don't agree with him. No sense of souring things up over an indie game.

Perhaps text made it unclear but we were only fucking around and humorously outlining the fact that our friendship is unbreakable, even with such a strong and meaningful disagreement between each other as what video game client to use for a 2D game.

i.e., sarcasm.

[Azpire]

On another topic, you and your friend's opinion may differ but you at least should respect each other's opinion even if you don't agree with him. No sense of souring things up over an indie game.

Perhaps text made it unclear but we were only fucking around and humorously outlining the fact that our friendship is unbreakable, even with such a strong and meaningful disagreement between each other as what video game client to use for a 2D game.

i.e., sarcasm.

I have never once seen them argue. It's always discussion, and they usually are very meaningful. It may not be clear in text but this friend of Scubas and mine is very intelligent and we respect his opinions. Doesn't mean there are always agreements, but how boring would that be?

[sabinati]

It certainly sucks less than the default client.

I agree completely. The default client is terrible compared to Ender's. I use Ender's myself.

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=31289&p=407565

[jonamaster]

I use Ender's Client beause if not, i'm an idiot. I don't like it, but if you don't use Ender's then other players will have an UBER advantage over you.
Sad but true, it's like cheating, but not considered as a cheat because all community uses it. Every time i see this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v72vZb2FL5M) i feel like i'm playing another game

[sabinati]

hide behind a tree and then jump out and murder your friend for great justice