I have no suggestions on how to fix it, I just want it to be different
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theTrav
- Posts: 3464
- Joined: Fri May 29, 2009 11:25 pm
Rewards for living in the middle of civilisation are poor
Hideously biased on this one as I am, I don't think I'm wrong when I say that living in Mordor is VASTLY more appealing to players than living in a highly populated area.
I have no suggestions on how to fix it, I just want it to be different
I have no suggestions on how to fix it, I just want it to be different
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loftar
- Posts: 9096
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- Location: Your character database
Re: Rewards for living in the middle of civilisation are poor
We have, of course, been well aware for quite a while, and have been discussing various ways to remedy the situation. I can't really say that we've reached any useful conclusions yet, though, but it is definitely true that Mordor is supposed to be generally unappealing, while populated areas are supposed to be appealing (which is obviously the opposite of the current actual situation).
"Object-oriented design is the roman numerals of computing." -- Rob Pike
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Peter
- Posts: 1491
- Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2009 3:36 am
Re: Rewards for living in the middle of civilisation are poor
Just to try a really random possibility, how about this:
-Animals in the wild get endlessly increasingly difficult.
-Average Q of wild animals approaches 1 as savagery increases, though some unique "boss" animals have very high Q stuff.
-Domesticated animals gradually increase in Q.
-Eliminate black skills.
-Do not allow anyone to play.
I think I lost my train of thought somewhere...
-Animals in the wild get endlessly increasingly difficult.
-Average Q of wild animals approaches 1 as savagery increases, though some unique "boss" animals have very high Q stuff.
-Domesticated animals gradually increase in Q.
-Eliminate black skills.
-Do not allow anyone to play.
I think I lost my train of thought somewhere...
Surprise.
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Jackard
- Posts: 8849
- Joined: Sun Jul 12, 2009 6:07 am
- Location: fucking curios how do they work
Re: Rewards for living in the middle of civilisation are poor
:facepalm: how much thought do you really give your suggestions?Peter wrote:-Animals in the wild get endlessly increasingly difficult.
thats the exact opposite of one aspect needed to reduce grind - the removal of animal levels
Last edited by Jackard on Tue Dec 08, 2009 7:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
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theTrav
- Posts: 3464
- Joined: Fri May 29, 2009 11:25 pm
Re: Rewards for living in the middle of civilisation are poor
Current rewards for mordor:loftar wrote:it is definitely true that Mordor is supposed to be generally unappealing
Better quality animal products accross the board
Higher LP for killing animals that are of no more threat to character than LVL 1 animals
Largely un-molested by random griefers
Current rewards for being in populated area:loftar wrote:while populated areas are supposed to be appealing (which is obviously the opposite of the current actual situation).
slightly decreased decay rates...
Ok, so how about you do something like:
1 - Make mordor animals worth EXACTLY THE SAME LP as lvl 1 animals.
2 - Make HQ animal components a locational factor rather than a function of the animal level (maybe link it to quality water sources?)
There straight away you're cutting out 80% of the appeal of mordor.
If you did those things I would almost never visit it, I would have no reason to.
Most players will complain bitterly about such a change.
This is largely because they want the LP, but as you've said the LP system is already badly flawed. Why continue to use it as an influencing factor?
The next thing I'd recommend after those quick changes (if you have time) is to re-do hunting.
1 - Don't use the same combat you intend to use for PvP.
2 - Don't make it so a single character can take down a bear, no matter how much you love your blaze it creates a solo favoring game rather than a multi player game.
3 - Make animals over a certain level eat you when you get knocked down and there are no other targets around.
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theTrav
- Posts: 3464
- Joined: Fri May 29, 2009 11:25 pm
Re: Rewards for living in the middle of civilisation are poor
If the LP and quality gain did not increase with the difficulty of the animal I would have no problem with making them more difficult.Jackard wrote::facepalm: how much thought do you really give your suggestions?Peter wrote:-Animals in the wild get endlessly increasingly difficult.
thats the exact opposite of one aspect needed to reduce grind - the removal of animal levels
Hard to kill animals should be a negative attribute to a region, not a reward for players who want to challenge themselves.
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Potjeh
- Posts: 11825
- Joined: Fri May 29, 2009 4:03 pm
Re: Rewards for living in the middle of civilisation are poor
Until there are actual crime safety benefits from living in civilized areas, everyone will live in Mordor. Obscurity, as unreliable as it is, is better than nothing.
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Yolan
- Posts: 1097
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- Location: Japan
Re: Rewards for living in the middle of civilisation are poor
I think an update of village code would go a long way, as mentioned weeks (months?) back. Combined with some big-ass stone city walls, and domestication.
- With domestication you could get animals of increasingly high Q, but maybe link that quality to civ level. So, best Q domestic animals could only be raised in civilized areas.
- With domestication you could get animals of increasingly high Q, but maybe link that quality to civ level. So, best Q domestic animals could only be raised in civilized areas.
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Chakravanti
- Posts: 3345
- Joined: Sat Aug 29, 2009 3:38 am
Re: Rewards for living in the middle of civilisation are poor
Civ values could go higher than causing the lowest L1 animals (Based on butchering it seems there are various grades within levels).
Scents could take longer to decay in high civ areas than low civ, meaning villages that invest lotsof communal effort will have greater means of arbitrating justice.
Furthermore, members of said civilization might gainthe benefit of leaving lesser scents or allowing village authority (And dually lend further purpose to authority!) to erase scents. Then invaders who fail and are slain can't take a murder alt to go back, gather scents & summon slay. People who want to 'spar' can also do so with the added benefit of having their scents removed afterward.
Things like Cheese racks could ferment faster, steel production etc. Ticks in general could be sped up based on civ values for farming and such. This may or may not lend itself to realism but the game mechanics for benefit are clear. Hunters do best in the wild, and production does best in civilization.
Spawn rates for plains types could be increased giving the farmer who makes a nice lawn next to his farm and homestead in a given village the advantage of having frequent farm animal spawns.Once domestication is in, breeding rates.
Basically, give a slight to moderate speed boost to production based on civ values.
Scents could take longer to decay in high civ areas than low civ, meaning villages that invest lotsof communal effort will have greater means of arbitrating justice.
Furthermore, members of said civilization might gainthe benefit of leaving lesser scents or allowing village authority (And dually lend further purpose to authority!) to erase scents. Then invaders who fail and are slain can't take a murder alt to go back, gather scents & summon slay. People who want to 'spar' can also do so with the added benefit of having their scents removed afterward.
Things like Cheese racks could ferment faster, steel production etc. Ticks in general could be sped up based on civ values for farming and such. This may or may not lend itself to realism but the game mechanics for benefit are clear. Hunters do best in the wild, and production does best in civilization.
Spawn rates for plains types could be increased giving the farmer who makes a nice lawn next to his farm and homestead in a given village the advantage of having frequent farm animal spawns.Once domestication is in, breeding rates.
Basically, give a slight to moderate speed boost to production based on civ values.
Well what is this that I can't see
With ice cold hands takin' hold of me
Well I am death, none can excel
-Ralph Stanley, O Death!
With ice cold hands takin' hold of me
Well I am death, none can excel
-Ralph Stanley, O Death!
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firemage
- Posts: 76
- Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2009 7:00 pm
Re: Rewards for living in the middle of civilisation are poor
Ok, we have many rewards for living in Mordor and next to none for living in the civilized areas.theTrav wrote:Current rewards for mordor:loftar wrote:it is definitely true that Mordor is supposed to be generally unappealing
Better quality animal products accross the board
Higher LP for killing animals that are of no more threat to character than LVL 1 animals
Largely un-molested by random griefers
Current rewards for being in populated area:loftar wrote:while populated areas are supposed to be appealing (which is obviously the opposite of the current actual situation).
slightly decreased decay rates...
But why nerf Mordor then instead of increasing the benefits of civilization?
e.g.
better quality crafts (including farming, animal domestication, smithing...)
increased LP rewards for hi Q crafts
The problem is not that Morder has to many benefits, it's that civilization has next to none!
And for the rest I completely agree with Chakravanti.