Teaching and learning

[minck1]

Lastly, if you're still stubbornly obsessed with the absurd notion of realism then consider why the fuck on earth making several thousand plates or swords would give you any skill whatsoever in crafting jewelry.

Agreed. A separate jewelling skill would be superior.

while Jewelcraft is a very different entity from smithing it does share some similarities. Allow a smith to get 25% jewelcraft experience while he smiths. Allow a farmer to get some cooking exp. (from food knowledge).

[HamburgerBL]

I still fail to see a valid argument on your behalf. You say it will lead to excessive grinding, however this is not any different than the current mechanic. I shouldn't have to plow 20 fields or kill 10 bears in order to get better at smithing. I should get better at smithing by smithing.

This would also help prevent people from being good with every skill, encourage specialization and trade, and would be more balanced.

[warrri]

Agreeing with Chak, puking in the background, agreeing with the op on #3 though

#2 is hardcore abusable
and #1 is hardcore boring, tedious and repetetive

[Chakravanti]

I still fail to see a valid argument on your behalf. You say it will lead to excessive grinding, however this is not any different than the current mechanic. I shouldn't have to plow 20 fields or kill 10 bears in order to get better at smithing. I should get better at smithing by smithing.

Currently the 'grind factor' is involved in making useful products. Not ideal but a shitton better than making a massive fuckton of useless shit.

Lastly, if you're still stubbornly obsessed with the absurd notion of realism then consider why the fuck on earth making several thousand plates or swords would give you any skill whatsoever in crafting jewelry.

Agreed. A separate jewelling skill would be superior.

while Jewelcraft is a very different entity from smithing it does share some similarities. Allow a smith to get 25% jewelcraft experience while he smiths. Allow a farmer to get some cooking exp. (from food knowledge).

On the contrary. Adopting the historic profession of a blacksmith permanently bars one from ever being able to craft jewelry. In fact,the two skills are so entirely disparate that the physical strength, constitution and dexterous requirements for each profession are far an apart. It's not about experience. Having massive strength and endurance with moderate dexterity is what is required to be a blacksmith. Those who aren't already, will become with years of work and experience, massive in size and strength. A jeweler on the other hand requires very little strength at all and an extremely high presence of mind, focus, attention to detail and dexterity to complement such discipline.

Now, Go make me 50k pieces of jewelry and tell me that scarcity of resource is a sustainable and practical game mechanics under such terms of character development.

[sonerohi]

Chak, from what I can tell your problem lays within the idea that one must pump out thirty metric assloads of vendor trash before a worthwhile product. I'm sure that, should the game go this way, skill will increase more rapidly depending on scarcity of resources. Farmers would get better slowly, because crops are an infinite resource as long as labor is applied. Jewelry smiths would have huge initial jumps, with the skill gain slowly decreasing.

[Chakravanti]

vendor trash

This.

thirty metric assloads

Not as much this but when you put them together you get runescape.

It doesn't matter how much it takes to get to a certain level. You go fucking mine up some gold and silver and then tell me you want this. Do ANY of you guys even own a REGULAR mine? I didn't think so. STFU seriously. Not for my sake, for your own. You have no idea how asinine you appear.

[sonerohi]

Actually, the village I belong to owns a gold mine and an iron mine. We've been trading it to you for silver recently, I think . What is being proposed is pretty reasonable provided J&L take the time to make it reasonable. If you just slap it into the current system, it sucks a bag of donkey dick. If you implement rewarding arcs of diminishing returns, with the point where it starts to level off at a high enough level, then it could be a very good system. In the example of jewelry, the novice jeweler might screw up for whatever reason, and make a crappy ring, q 20 for exemplary purposes. He learns from it, and the next ring sees significant improvement, say q 60-70. The next one is at 100, and the next 110, and so on. To get to the point where you can only raise quality a point or two at a time, you have already passed the point where those few points matter.

[Chakravanti]

vendor trash

[minck1]

while Jewelcraft is a very different entity from smithing it does share some similarities. Allow a smith to get 25% jewelcraft experience while he smiths. Allow a farmer to get some cooking exp. (from food knowledge).

On the contrary. Adopting the historic profession of a blacksmith permanently bars one from ever being able to craft jewelry. In fact,the two skills are so entirely disparate that the physical strength, constitution and dexterous requirements for each profession are far an apart. It's not about experience. Having massive strength and endurance with moderate dexterity is what is required to be a blacksmith. Those who aren't already, will become with years of work and experience, massive in size and strength. A jeweler on the other hand requires very little strength at all and an extremely high presence of mind, focus, attention to detail and dexterity to complement such discipline.

Now, Go make me 50k pieces of jewelry and tell me that scarcity of resource is a sustainable and practical game mechanics under such terms of character development.

In the real world, blacksmiths buy iron and jewelers buy gold. In the game, most of the time blacksmithing and jewelcraft include the mining and smelting of the metals. This is where the cross skill training would come in. Better mining and smelting techniques and why cross learning only should give 10-25% skill. Unless a seperate mining/smelting skill were added.

[minck1]

I still fail to see a valid argument on your behalf. You say it will lead to excessive grinding, however this is not any different than the current mechanic. I shouldn't have to plow 20 fields or kill 10 bears in order to get better at smithing. I should get better at smithing by smithing.

Currently the 'grind factor' is involved in making useful products. Not ideal but a shitton better than making a massive fuckton of useless shit.

Mass producing tea pots and looms is making useful products?