Screw The Botters

Thoughts on the further development of Haven & Hearth? Feel free to opine!
User avatar
dafels
Posts: 3071
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2010 7:49 pm
Yahoo Messenger: davis

Screw The Botters

Post by dafels »

Stat caps are bad, I suggest that we rather make stat effectivity to be scaled with stat value in a logarithmic way.

Image

From the graph:
Once you reach 300 stats, the effectivity is 100%.
Once you reach 2000 stats, the effectivity is 110%.

Stats to be scaled:
Strength:A player with 2000 stats will deal only for 10% more damage than a player with 300 stats.
Constitution: A player with 2000 con will only have 10% more hitpoints than a player with 300 stats has.
Agility: A player with 2000 agi will be 10% faster than a player with 300 stats.


Pros:
Doesn't set a limit to stats, keeps the unlimited stat grind in the game.

Cons:
Botters are going to be mad
User avatar
overtyped
Posts: 3906
Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2010 2:09 am
Location: Quaran book burning festival

Re: Screw The Botters

Post by overtyped »

dafels wrote:Stat caps are bad, I suggest that we rather make stat effectivity to be scaled with stat value in a logarithmic way.

Image

From the graph:
Once you reach 300 stats, the effectivity is 100%.
Once you reach 2000 stats, the effectivity is 110%.

Stats to be scaled:
Strength:A player with 2000 stats will deal only for 10% more damage than a player with 300 stats.
Constitution: A player with 2000 con will only have 10% more hitpoints than a player with 300 stats has.
Agility: A player with 2000 agi will be 10% faster than a player with 300 stats.


Pros:
Doesn't set a limit to stats, keeps the unlimited stat grind in the game.

Cons:
Botters are going to be mad
nah... you are just assuming everyone is a casual, and doesn't care about stats. What this does is hurt people that want to make a good character.
Early world exploit: Put your hearthfire inside a cave, then hold shift to position a claim right in front of a cave. After 8 hours the claim will be unbreakable. Since your hearthfire is inside the cave, you can still get back inside, and leave, but nobody will be able to enter, effectively making you unraidable for the first 3-7 days. Enjoy
User avatar
Redlaw
Posts: 1638
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2011 10:58 pm

Re: Screw The Botters

Post by Redlaw »

Don't we already have this in the game? 10, 20, 40, 80, 160 ect... are when how effective things are doubled.
User avatar
dafels
Posts: 3071
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2010 7:49 pm
Yahoo Messenger: davis

Re: Screw The Botters

Post by dafels »

Redlaw wrote:Don't we already have this in the game?
No.
User avatar
Redlaw
Posts: 1638
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2011 10:58 pm

Re: Screw The Botters

Post by Redlaw »

So your saying make the dimishing returns worse after a point? so the time it would double after 340, (680), it only increase by 10% instead of another doubling of the base amount?
User avatar
LadyGoo
Posts: 2767
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2011 9:06 am

Re: Screw The Botters

Post by LadyGoo »

He is taking it to an absurd level when no-one would care to upping the stats after a certain point. It doesn't stimulate trades and people won't see any reason to level up further.
The devs already implemented things so that with 200 ua you will have only 16% disadvantage to a player with 400 ua.
Something like this is understandable, since gaining lp is much harder than attributes.

But when there is only 10% difference if you'd get 2000 stats, that's just another stat cap. And all of us have already seen what impossibility to constantly improve leads to. Not really thought-through post.
Hafen Helpdesk Skype Conference [Eng]: https://join.skype.com/mxo3yVNbrCK9
Справочная Конференция [Ru]: https://join.skype.com/fnAcsc0srDBN

Trade Conference [Eng-Ru]: https://join.skype.com/gNT6Rs92PTtM

W10 Queen of Dis fiancée of Leanne69 (Lolo)
W9 Hive [Ruler]
W8 Dis [Chieftain]
W7 Ofir [Lawspeaker]
W6 Dis [Chieftain] & Disneyland
W5 Vitterstad [Lawspeaker]
W4 A.D. [Fighter]
W3 Garden of Metallurgists [LS]
User avatar
ricky
Posts: 1475
Joined: Fri Apr 02, 2010 5:00 am

Re: Screw The Botters

Post by ricky »

horizontal asymptote should be in place, but with much more lenient numbers.

how about set base ability, 100% ability at the old stat cap of 330 and set double base ability, 200% power at 3300, 10x the base. and for triple base ability, 300% power, should be set at 33000, 100x the base.

so:
330 = 100%
3300 = 200%
33000 = 300%
330000 = 400% (if this is even physically possible)
Have a question? Need help? Tired of people asking questions? Haven and Hearth Wiki.
jorb wrote:Ideally the game should play itself.
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.
User avatar
sMartins
Posts: 3442
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2015 10:21 pm
Location: Italy

Re: Screw The Botters

Post by sMartins »

I'm agree for sure...i don't know what is the current curve, and which numbers we need...but i agree for sure, if is not already the case, that the stats gain curve should be the inverse of the exponential. Then it's only a balance matter...

P.S. Yeah with an asymptote i mean...is the current curve a logaritm with no asymptote at all?
Make friends with the other crabs or try to escape the bucket.
I'd hardly call anything the Bible of our times. » special thanks to MagicManICT
I only logged in to say this sentence. by neeco » 30 Oct 2018, 02:57
Default Client, Best Client!
User avatar
tyrtix
Posts: 1108
Joined: Wed Feb 19, 2014 12:54 am
Location: Leghorn

Re: Screw The Botters

Post by tyrtix »

Redlaw wrote:Don't we already have this in the game? 10, 20, 40, 80, 160 ect... are when how effective things are doubled.
This: ppl just won't understand there already is a cap in the game, i suppose devs just removed the cap because they understood that after 300 the return in stats will be lessened to an extend that at some point is just not worth continue. I already proposed a logaritmic scale for stat return (now is not exactly like that), but anyway such return have to be enough so some ppl will continue raising stats, even if the effort is not repayed (but they enjoy in that way, who cares)...

I guess devs knew already that the difference in game by having or not having stat caps is not all that important, also gaming stats says clearly that ppl that have a powergaming mind trough the game is the one that generally invest more money in the game itself, so making them happy have a good return, while caring for all the gamers categories and trying to have a balance in the playerbase make the game alive.
My critique now is that the game is not noob friendly enough to have a decent player retention (i remember when in salem devs asked for that issue and everyone told them to make a functional tutorial). Right now i can say, with a small analysis, that the problem fo the noob is the fact that get killed in the first phases of the game is incredibly easy, and getting killed = loosing all the progress made. The game also features a steep starting curve, while going on everything becomes really easy (always for a noob.. a pro player knows few tricks to lessen the curve to the point it become flat...).
I saw clearly that a large part of the actual playerbase is tied (too much) to that way of thinking, and any small difficulty inserted in the game become a motivation for asking many things to become even more easy or requires less time/resources to make, especially when the thing affects directly their gaming ideas and ideals.

To some extents, botters are a known thing and is still in place because a war at botting is a waste of time, and to some others, because botting become a feature for those players that have a certain style of play.
Another thing is, instead, finding a balance to those who can't or won't bot for having 2k stats, and those who do.
Maybe saying that at death we regain stats inversely proportional to the stats we have, instead of a fixed %, may be better.
User avatar
sMartins
Posts: 3442
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2015 10:21 pm
Location: Italy

Re: Screw The Botters

Post by sMartins »

tyrtix wrote:Maybe saying that at death we regain stats inversely proportional to the stats we have, instead of a fixed %, may be better.
Yeah, this is pretty clever also....good idea.
Btw,in my mind, an asymptote at some point is also required (if there isn't already one).

P.S. Even more if we aim to have a permanent world.
Make friends with the other crabs or try to escape the bucket.
I'd hardly call anything the Bible of our times. » special thanks to MagicManICT
I only logged in to say this sentence. by neeco » 30 Oct 2018, 02:57
Default Client, Best Client!

Return to “Critique & Ideas”