Hafens barrier to entry

[Hasta]

As a filthy casual larpy cutesy farmer with zero pvp skills or desire to be involved in pvp, I think you're wrong.

This boreworm conundrum, although unfortunate, has nothing to do with custom clients and advantages of alternative rendering in PvP, barely relevant part is the subject of controls (in PvE there are way less required). Hovewer, speaking from teaching-wife-to-outrun-a-boar experience, your particluar problem is not controls-sided, but, rather, lack of general expertise. Don't worry, you'll get there

[Reiber]

Exactly.. new render works fine, and performance is good. Sadly there is no good publicly available new render PvP client, so big boys without faction need to use cediner, which works on old resources and is laggy as fk

Yeah, well, what can you do. Factions have the good clients, and they aint sharing anytime soon.

Without being able to disable terrain elevation, and without proper pvp options, a client is not viable. Until a new client is made, Ardes will remain the only client that is useable besides the faction ones, and it just happens to have the worst performance by far ;/ I actually really hate using it, but it's not like Loftar is ever gonna add good pvp options as standard in the launcher client.

If you try to fight without a viable client then you are just meat on the chopping block.

wich i would say is an far steeper barrier of entry than the inherent wonkiness of the game, its less bad to be weak because i havent killed my self for extra stats, or because i dont have an armada of players/bots forcefeeding my char, but being unviable because i havent developed an custom client that strips the game down to an tactical minimap is dogshit

and with all due respect bob dole, you argue that it isnt cheating because the devs dont punish it, wich is an fair point, take every advantage that dosnt get you nuked, and keep it , thats how competetive games work, and thats especially how this game works,
but having an publically unavailable 3th party client that allows you to do things and see things "normal" people dont is as much of an unfair out of game advantage as you can get,

in an perfect world jorb would have made an non dogshit vanilla client and we would all see the same things, and have the same amount of amenitys and functions, but thats sadly not the timeline we live in, where we live , we are dependant on having access to the right set of out of game tools,scripts and bot assistance. not just for pvp but even the mundane jobs aka"larping" heavily benefits from knowing or being an skilled coder,

[Dawidio123]

wich i would say is an far steeper barrier of entry than the inherent wonkiness of the game, its less bad to be weak because i havent killed my self for extra stats, or because i dont have an armada of players/bots forcefeeding my char, but being unviable because i havent developed an custom client that strips the game down to an tactical minimap is dogshit

The fact that a lot of public clients still use the original sprites that only have the colored corner for the combat openings, instead of just solid full color openings is insane to me, also no numbers like wtf.

[Miss_Min]

patronising unhelpfulness

Well bless your heart, sugar, and thank you for the kind words.

My understanding from this thread:
Private custom clients have the ability to use the keyboard to select which of multiple opponents (and/or potential opponents) you wish to target

My previous understanding of public clients:
In combat with multiple opponents? Move the mouse and click the little pictures in the top right of the screen until you find the right one. Oh whoops, too late, you had to take time to move the mouse and stopped running (ran into something, whatever, I know how to keep running in a straight line if one is available). You are now surrounded. Oh dear.

The skill issue is not one that is going to change over time. I have been using computers with mice for a few years now and have reached a plateau on my ability to combine speed and accuracy with my available setup. I can achieve a greater level of speed*accuracy if I can do some of this shit on a keyboard instead.

Muahahaha I attacked you but you can't see me because I'm hiding behind a cliff!!1!

So uh, I am going to assume that the unfamiliar person right there on my minimap is the one attacking me? Like I remember the big dramas of oh no there are custom clients with radars that can show the presence of other people before they actually appear on your screen! But ... the default client has a radar now, right? Like yes mountain terrain is generally shit in any of the clients I've used and it would be nice to have the option of navigating without having to do it on the map, but it's not the end of the world.

[Apocoreo]

ITT this Aerona guy who joined less than a month ago retards all over the place and people take anything he says seriously for some reason.

[Audiosmurf]

I thought ctrl+tab to cycle targets was vanilla

[overtyped]

I thought ctrl+tab to cycle targets was vanilla

Even if that's true, thats barely one card out of a full deck. You also need to be able to mark your targets so your allies can see who you are switching to, you need to be able to target closest, you need to be able to see the combat manuevers, defenses, and coins above everyones head. This is all vital information.

Pvpers also like to play with cliffs specifically because we know alot of people don't have terrain flatenning. At a minimum, if the terrain is not flat, you won't be able to join the fight especially if the cliffs are bad enough, and you will be left behind a long time ago. Swinging your camera around might help you if you are lucky, and you can angle yourself, and then click fast enough. However, best case, the other fighters are already half a minimap away because they didn't need to do anything that you are doing with your larper client.

One of the reason's for being easily left behind, is because a pvper will jump down the cliff, then immediatly jump back up, while the larpers can't even see that he's doing this. So, they don't jump back up until he's already all the way up, because they can't even see he's jumping on their clients, the cliff is fully obscuring their view. You are not a pvper if you use a larper client, you are food. Even 10v1 I would feel 100% safe going up against larpers, you have no way to catch me, you have no way to coordinate, you have no way to fight me, simply because you are playing with a single card out of a otherwise full deck.

Loftar needs to add the bare essentials to the launcher client, and he needs to do it yesterday. If he keeps relying on the players to fix the client for him, he's damaging his own game. Since the only useable public client is ards, and it gives terrible fps, that means all of havens fps is terrible.

[noindyfikator]

I have bad information for you, and all of us. Unfortunately.

We have been asking him for years about it. There were many "improve default client for pvp" requests on stream but response was negative.

They just don't want to do it.

Drink button was 8 years fiesta of begging them. Loftar finally implemented it but it's still unusable. You can set drink only for hotkeys 1-10, combat UI takes 1-5. No one will click number 6 on keyboard for drinking. It is what it is.

[Gensokyo]

You can set drink only for hotkeys 1-10, combat UI takes 1-5. No one will click number 6 on keyboard for drinking. It is what it is.

You can bind it (among literally every other UI button) to any button on your keyboard.

[Hasta]

The skill issue is not one that is going to change over time

*cough* I'm not used to being on this side of the notorious "farmville argument"...