Do you think jorb still enjoys working on the game?

[APXEOLOG]

Speaking about the original title of the thread, this is my vision of the current situation of the game:

1. Development is blocked by OCO for the past couple of years
Now, while we can meme about OCO, the thing is that it is a very complicated feature.
The implementation requires modification of the most of the core parts of the H&H engine on the fundamental level - both server-side and client-side.
It would basically require to overhaul half of the game which is a huge undertaking considering ~15 years of development and (probably) some legacy undocumented parts of the game engine.
It can be done with enough time and motivation but here comes #2

2. Both jorb and loftar do not have much time to work on a pet project anymore
As far as I know (may be wrong here) both of them are working full-time normal human job.
I can confirm from my experience that it is extremely hard to find any resources to spend on a pet project while working 40hrs/week.
Now, it is still possible to do some content updates with motivation spikes, but not when you're blocked with #3

3. The changes for OCO probably not very compartible with the big new features
Not mentioning the fact the loftar basically well need to work on 2 parallel versions of the game, he will also need to rework the new big features for the OCO afterwards, doing double the work.
So it makes sense to finish the OCO first to not make everything harder, but then you cannot finish it because it is already hard, and then you are stuck in the procrastination cycle.
You also don't want to discard OCO because you already invested years of work into it, so you will just be throwing away all that effort.

So TLDR the situation is following:
They need to deal with OCO first, they cannot finish it due to complexity and lack of time&motivation, they cannot discard it because they already invested too much.
I've been in a similar situations before and it sucks to be there.

Answering the original question of the thread:
Yes, I think they both still enjoy working on the game, but not right now, because they are stuck in the procrastination swamp.

To be honest, I think they just need to drop OCO. It is painful to discard years of work, but H&H is a great game even without walkable bridges.
There are so many ways to develop it further even without OCO.

[Slurpin_DaCum]

OCO is fake name to fake feature

[SnuggleSnail]

To be honest, I think they just need to drop OCO. It is painful to discard years of work, but H&H is a great game even without walkable bridges.

Na, it'd be funnier if they kept knowingly choosing projects too large for the resources they have. Then when they inevitably under deliver hand wave it all away by saying "but we're only two people."

Game devs get a lot of undue hate from entitled people. Reading twitter responses to even the most well liked game devs is WILD. I feel like my opinion here sounds extreme so it'll get lumped in with that, but I genuinely from the bottom of my heart believe haven was better in 2020 than it is in 2024. By a lot. I think most people would 2018. The majority of patches make the game worse.

Jorb and Loftar have, as far as I know, never played the game outside of as solo hermits with dev powers who barely care about progressing. Their experience represents probably less than 1% of users. If you don't understand what or why a user wants something, it seems nearly impossible to improve a product for them regardless of how much time you spend on development.

[terechgracz]

i wonder why default client is so bad
loftar uses emacs
but controlling haven is so shite
why for so long time we can't control haven solely through keyboard?
is loftar emacser who touches mouse? this is greate question, i'd like to see some devstreams from him

[Dawidio123]

Jorb and Loftar have, as far as I know, never played the game outside of as solo hermits with dev powers who barely care about progressing. Their experience represents probably less than 1% of users. If you don't understand what or why a user wants something, it seems nearly impossible to improve a product for them regardless of how much time you spend on development.

TBH, i think that's the huge part of the problem, and it really shows. The world before this one when they introduced stacks like super late the only thing that they changed about them is to make them not game breaking bcs ppl fucked around with them, but y'know bugs slip. What doesn't slip is actual lack of QoL that you WILL notice once you play with a mechanic for a day, i literally made a post pointing out like 5-6 things that could be improved for stacks after using them FOR A DAY in an early game setup before the start of this world.
Most of the improvements i suggested got implemented over the course of this world (ie. stockpiles from stacks), but it was like 1 thing per patch kind of deal and because a lot of people complained profusely once they started using the mechanic. All these things could've been implemented right away if the devs actually tried to use the mechanic for a day before pushing it.

[Robbin_DuCradle]

Calm down, kittens. Or daddy will calm you down with his strong arms.

[Gauhörnchen]

The only solution is to buy more goldsubs!

[terechgracz]

this conversation is rely nigericious

[dafels]

Fr fr they should drop oco if they don't have the capacity/resources to complete the project while impeding other things for years because of that. I don't need larp shit like walkable bridges or knarrs who cares, that won't make the player count go up or make the game experience better

[Flushin_DaToilet]

The only solution is to buy more goldsubs!

THIS!!!!!!
stinky bitchboys shouldnt be allowed to WHINE about the game unless theyve purchesed every single store hat and have a year long gold sub at miminum!